The most significant SF novel ever?

[merritt]

The Starmaker by Olaf Stapledon

Fantastic journey, many different extra galactic beings and civilisations. It probably influenced the writers of the golden age to some degree.

check it out

 

[Connavar]

I wouldn't recommend the Hamiltons. From what I remember, he has one Muslim character referring to Jesus as an "infidel prophet", proving how little research he did on Islam...

Haha what a big shock

Cause of that your post made me luagh.

 

[TK-421]

Difficult to pin it down to just one novel. I would list (in no specific order):

Dune
Stranger in a Strange Land
I, Robot
Farenheit 451
1984
Star Wars (Original Trilogy)
Frankenstein (yes, it is a SF novel if your definition of SF is inclusive)

 

[Connavar]

Star Wars ? You mean the novel on the movie?


Nice to see a Heinlein in your list.

 

[gully_foyle]

I would exclude 1984 (and the Star Wars novel), because I don't see it as having a big influence on SF, either on the way SF was constructed, or on the people who read SF, or by bringing people into the SF fold. But, I would put Brave New World in its place.

And Stranger in a Strange Land? A popular book in its day, loved by hippies, but painful to read these days for its naivety and Heinlein's endless political and philosophical tirades. A cult classic, yes, but not the most significant.

 

[Connavar]

I havent read Stranger but i think SF book that was very important in its day is very significant. Heinlein or whoever it is. You can say the same for your fav TSMD, not dated but it was prolly more imporant in it day than it is today cause it was one of the first of its kind.


Also you cant say its not significant cause of RAH's political and philosophical ideas. THEY are what made him one of the most popular if not the most popular SF writer of 20th century.

You might as well say RAH was not important for SF if you think his strenghts are what made one of his books bad.

 

[gully_foyle]

Heinlein was up there as one of the most significant authors. Some of his works were certainly significant at the time. But now?

 

[Connavar]

Heinlein was up there as one of the most significant authors. Some of his works were certainly significant at the time. But now?

His work has dated best compared to other greats i have read.

You only have to go your book store to know he still is important. He has more books in print than other many other great SF writers put together.
That shows he still works for newer generations. People like me that thinks his work is timeless. You can get almost any book he has ever written. While i have tried to get other big guns at his day and have to get second hand versions. It shows he is still loved and that makes him important. Every old big gun SF writer isnt that lucky.

I could careless critics and SF bizz rate him one of the big three. Or if you been what he have meant for the genre, go read his wiki page or other places you can read what he has meant for the genre,other authors,military etc

I wish there was a new Heinlien, i love social SF. Stories like Moon is A Harsh Mistress never get old. Problem i have with the modern writers i have read is that it isnt much about ideas political or philosophical more about great adventure among the stars.

Then i see people cry about Heinlein bieng preachy and think you dont have to read him there are plenty new brainless, empty SF to read......

I dont wanna diss everyone who dont like him but i saw a guy say RAH was the worst SF he had read cause he was preachy. If RAH is the worst SF you have read you are very lucky.

Sure im biased RAH is my favorit SF writer but apparently im not the only one that thinks RAH is important among the modern readers. I dont care if the so called experts dont think he isnt important anymore.

 

[TK-421]

Yes, I meant Star Wars the novels that accompanied the movies and yes, it had a significant impact.

 

[Connavar]

Yes, I meant Star Wars the novels that accompanied the movies and yes, it had a significant impact.

How do you mean? Can you explain ?


Didnt Star Wars rip off Dune as someone said in this same thread?

 

[j d worthington]

On the subject of RAH... yes, he's still quite influential, as a lot of the sf writers of the past 30+ years have quite often acknowledged him as a major influence, the majority of his work is still in print (and sells quite well), and he still garners critical notice and debate even now; and Stranger in a Strange Land is one of those which garners the most attention, for that matter; a book which has (so far as I am aware) not gone out of print for any length of time since its first publication in either the original or the uncut version. It was (and is) also well-thought-of by a fairly wide spectrum of readers, not just the hippies by any means; nor has it worn all that badly, as it is still one of the best critical examinations of various aspects of human society I can think of -- and a good deal more shrewd than naïve. I would have to argue that it was (and to some degree still is) indeed a rather significant sf novel....

 

[iansales]

Looking on Amazon, there only appears to be a couple of RAH's novels still in print in the UK - and Starship Troopers is one of them (and likely from the excellent Verhoeven film). But US reprints are readily available.

He's no longer so popular among British fans and hasn't been for a while - in fact, the general attitude seems to be that he wrote some excellent juveniles, but his "adult" fiction is not very good. Stranger in a Strange Land I've not reread since I first read it at age 15. I suspect I would hate it if I read it now. I Will Fear No Evil I've read a couple of times, and the experience has always been a bit like watching a soap opera slowly turn into televangelism. The Number of the Beast, Job, Friday, To Sail Beyond the Sunset I thought were poor when I read them, and that was back in the 1980s. To my knowledge, my feelings on his books are quite common among UK sf fans.

 

[Connavar]

On the subject of RAH... yes, he's still quite influential, as a lot of the sf writers of the past 30+ years have quite often acknowledged him as a major influence, the majority of his work is still in print (and sells quite well), and he still garners critical notice and debate even now; and Stranger in a Strange Land is one of those which garners the most attention, for that matter; a book which has (so far as I am aware) not gone out of print for any length of time since its first publication in either the original or the uncut version. It was (and is) also well-thought-of by a fairly wide spectrum of readers, not just the hippies by any means; nor has it worn all that badly, as it is still one of the best critical examinations of various aspects of human society I can think of -- and a good deal more shrewd than naïve. I would have to argue that it was (and to some degree still is) indeed a rather significant sf novel....

I dont get the hippies thing. Many books in SF are liked many decades after its realese. Sure a book is always more hyped when its brand new but the classics still work in modern times, which is why they are called classics.

When i read ST was a RAH newbie people that have read RAH still talked to me like Stranger was an important book. That shows it still works. Not many of us are old enough to be of the hippie generations

He sells pretty well for a legend. I see in my bookstore, his famous books selling like butter. I check his shelf space, where they refill alot cause of how much he sells.

Im spoiled by his lasting fame, i can even choose beteween different versions of his books by their covers. I read Roger Zelazny recently for the first time. I was so annoyed when my bookstore guy told me his classics that i wanted was only second hand versions. Times like that you remember how famous books always dont sell many decades later. Books that are seen as important SF works in forums like this doesnt sell automaticly even today. My version of Damnation Alley was a version some guy won in school competition.......

 

[gully_foyle]

Conn, all I can say is read Dune and then we can talk.

 

[Werthead]

Sure im biased RAH is my favorit SF writer but apparently im not the only one that thinks RAH is important among the modern readers. I dont care if the so called experts dont think he isnt important anymore.

Heinlein had a tremendous impact during his lifetime and remains of historical importance to the field. Many of his books - Stranger and Starship Troopers - remain important books today. However, Heinlein did his career immense damage by the surreal state of mind he descended into at the end of his career, with books like Number of the Beast which are nigh-on unreadable. Sure, that shouldn't affect his earlier books (like Dan Simmons' recent descent into Islamaphobe nutjob shouldn't change how much you like Hyperion, or Orson Scott Card's descent into right-wing militarist fool shouldn't change the quality of Ender's Game) but overall it lessens his impact.

I wish there was a new Heinlien, i love social SF. Stories like Moon is A Harsh Mistress never get old. Problem i have with the modern writers i have read is that it isnt much about ideas political or philosophical more about great adventure among the stars.

Richard Morgan. I've seen Black Man described as a Stranger in a Strange Land for the 21st Century and would agree, except I'd say it's better.

I am unfortunate in that I came to Heinlein very late, a decade or more after Asimov, Clarke, Herbert, Bester, Aldiss and the other greats of the period, and his works didn't have anywhere near as much of an impact on me (the same reason why Moorcock never really impressed me either). If I'd read Heinlein earlier, I'd probably have appreciated him a lot more.

 

[Ian Whates]

I wish there was a new Heinlien, i love social SF. Stories like Moon is A Harsh Mistress never get old. Problem i have with the modern writers i have read is that it isnt much about ideas political or philosophical more about great adventure among the stars.

Try Richard Morgan, Dan Simmons and Ken MacLeod, Con... between them you have SF with political views and philosophy aplenty!

 

[Connavar]

I found Richard Morgan to be very good. Although his TK books reminds me more of Besters TSMD with the cyperpunk and the way the world looks politicly. I liike and plan to read more of him.

Dan Simmons didnt like too much of Hyperion. Will try to finish it though just to see how i feel after the hole book.

K. Macleod, i didnt know of and will try him since im looking for more modern SF writers.

 

[mosaix]

War of the Worlds has got to be up there. First alien invasion story, first use of lasers as a weapon, anti-imperialist allegory, One of the first (and still just about the best) 'dead London' story, influenced Wyndham ('Day of the Triffids'), Christopher ('Tripods') and, oh, just about everybody since..........

War Of The Worlds gets my vote too.

 

[Connavar]

I would add The Time Machine which is prolly the first really famous time travel sf.

It was a great book too, isnt as dated as you would expect from a book older than a century.