George Lucas's "Tinkering" with the films

[Rodders]

I think that it's fair to say that we've all got two or more releases of the Original Star Wars Trilogy. Since the cinimatic rerelease of the Trilogy Special Edition versions, George has insisted on Tinkering with the fims on each subsequent release. Personally, i don't feel that they add too much to the films (I'd even go as far to say that some of these amendment detract from the film in some scenes.)

I just wondered what others thought? Do you like the additions?

 

[Culhwch]

No. I have the DVDs of the original trilogy where there are the two discs, one amended, one classic. Safe to say the amended versions will never see the tray of my DVD player.

 

[Dave]

I only have them on VHS video.

"Tinkering" - Hmmm! Some would say Greebo shooting first was a little more than 'tinkering'!

I liked what was done with Jabba though.

 

[Parson]

I haven't watched any of the versions in years. But on the whole I liked the "tinkering." I think that G.L. sees the films the way most of us look at the books we are/have written. It's good, but wouldn't it be better........" While the reader/watcher might say "You're messing with my story."

 

[Scifi fan]

I don't have the original, just the amended versions, but I would say the originals tend to be better, without the fluff.

 

[C Of K]

I've compared all the versions -- for several years now.The Special Edition on VHS video was the first I ever bought. Then I bought the DVD release. Neither of them could compare to the movies that once aired on the Scifi channel a few times a year, and I didn't know why.

Now, I think I do.

I had to buy the unaltered DVD's when they came out. There was nothing wrong with the Special Edition's wider shots, or the changes to the Yavin sky. there was nothing wrong with the Special Edition's heightened graphics, or any of that type of thing...but something robbed those movies of a small portion of their souls.

A classic example of this (and I've noted this before) was after Luke finally escapes Vader. It was after their fateful duel in the bowels of Cloud City. In the Special Edition, when the movie cuts back to Vader, he is cool, calm, collected, and he glides through the halls, commanding stormtroopers to, "prepare the Executor for his arrival."

In the original version, of the same scene, Vader is striding through the hallways of Cloud City, with a contingent of troopers hot on his heels. The camera almost shakes with his metal fury, and he demands that they "bring his shuttle," [to him].

That's it. His anger carried me seamlessly to the next scene. I was still captured by the character enough to suspend my reality, that I was really watching a movie.

That was the Vader I'd always known. Furious, and ready to lash out at a moments notice. That was the Vader that Admiral Piet feared would kill him once the Rebels escaped a few scenes later. That Darth Vader had soul, even if it was cyborg soul.

 

[Rodders]

C of K, that's exactly what i thought. That one scene ruined the entire thing for me. (Well, that, Greedo shooting first and a few others. )

 

[Interference]

I have no contention whatever with an artist re-jigging his work as he gets older and (presumably) more mature. But at the end of Return, he just ultra-hokeyed an already hokey scene - the ghost scene at the end, Ben, Dad and Yoda grinning like idiots. But the last time I saw it, it was young Dad and quite frankly, the bits of my body that weren't laughing were trying to throw up.

 

[reiver33]

I have to agree that I prefer the 'unadulterated' versions, but perhaps because these are the versions I saw all those years ago. Having said that, I do find some of the 'tinkering' to be little more than 'look what we can do these days', and just makes the background look busy.

 

[manephelien]

I like the improved effects but I don't like the changes to the story, with the one exception of the crawling Yabba. Making Greedo shoot first is the change that bugs me most.

 

[j d worthington]

Not a terribly big fan of the films as a whole anyway, I must admit. Oh, I enjoy them (the first two, at any rate), but I've not been tempted to buy the things save for very briefly when the unaltered original trilogy was available... though I could quite easily have done without the third there.

However, having seen rejigged versions opposed to the originals... yes, I think he botched the characters mightily with a fair amount of this nonsense. He already had problems with his own concepts of what the jedi were supposed to be (look at the original debates concerning the title of the third film, for instance), and his constant rethinking without having seriously thought about the internal logic of these concepts, or the genuine character motivations, beforehand (sorry, I know there have been debates about this, but the evidence seems to back me up) has just left us with a muddled mess when he goes anywhere near the things since Empire.

I realize my view of Lucas is extremely low, and has been since the third film was released; but frankly, the only version I would ever consider watching again is the original theatrical version of the first two films. Flaws and all, they had more artistic integrity and "heart" (rather than schmaltz) than anything that has been done with them since....

 

[AE35Unit]

I'm not sure what you all mean by the additions. What additions? The only difference I noticed was the final scene in the last original film where the 3 jedi knights appear and one of them is Anakin from the later film.

 

[j d worthington]

Well, you might want to take a look at this:

List of changes in Star Wars re-releases - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Rodders]

Yes AE there were a lot of changes. Some good, most bad. None really added anything to the plot or the film in general. I just wished he'd left the original alone.

 

[soulsinging]

I have to agree that I prefer the 'unadulterated' versions, but perhaps because these are the versions I saw all those years ago. Having said that, I do find some of the 'tinkering' to be little more than 'look what we can do these days', and just makes the background look busy.

That's actually what I disliked most about the recent prequel trilogy... so much of it seemed to be just showing off effects in an attempt to make everything seem huge... and so much attention went to that that the characters and themes felt miniscule in terms of importance by comparison.

I don't like most of the edits to the original. The scene with Jabba was interesting, added shots of other planets after the emperor's defeat are ok but unnecessary, and the digital touching up of sound and picture were actually excellent I thought (I wish they'd release a version of the original with no changes other than crisper sound and picture).

But the CGI effects are mostly tacked on for no apparent reason other than to have more stuff happening in the background, the change in the two songs in RotJ is completely arbitrary and pointless (putting 2 already dated 90s pop music pieces in place of 2 older dated music pieces from the 80s solves nothing), and Greedo shooting first is outright blasphemy.

The updated sound and picture is great. The tinkering with what's actually going on in the story and camera shots is generally awful and hugely distracting. I'll stick with the originals.

My brother tells me bluray plans have been announced and they will only include the new, tinkered version. He continues to ignore his fans' desire for a remastered version of the classic original.

 

[C Of K]

I thought the improved image and sound were ok. Personally, I liked the fuzzy picture, and the sound the way it was. Somehow it seems more faithful to the films, as if taking that out of the movies leaves them without an essential element of what made them what they were.

So many films suffer today, trying to make money off of amazing special effects and almost nothing else. That George Lucas reached back through time more than 20 years and retconned his original 3 movies in favor of adding super effects is a shame.

 

[Huttman]

I'm alright with the changes he's made. As an artist, I tinker with drawings and other projects I thought were done. Some of his vision was unfeasable to do back then, too. There were a few changes I would personally not have done, but it is his baby, and it does not change my viewing pleasure what-so-ever of these films. As a matter of fact, I would like to re-iterate something I've commented on before. A suggestion for one more change in RotJ. Please Mr. Lucas, re-do the Executor exploding as it nose dives into the death star II. That explosion is perhaps the worst in the saga. It looks as if they ignited a bunch of gasoline from the death star model which destroys the scale illusion. Ironic since one of the best explosions is in that same film when Jabba's sail barge becomes so much scrap. Oh yeah, that was some good pyro-technics.

 

[R M Tobias]

The originals please.

I sometimes wonder what it would be like if GL took all his creative energy and put it into something new rather then trying to "correct" something already classic.

 

[flickimp]

You mean like Star Wars VII

 

[soulsinging]

I'm alright with the changes he's made. As an artist, I tinker with drawings and other projects I thought were done. Some of his vision was unfeasable to do back then, too. There were a few changes I would personally not have done, but it is his baby, and it does not change my viewing pleasure what-so-ever of these films. As a matter of fact, I would like to re-iterate something I've commented on before. A suggestion for one more change in RotJ. Please Mr. Lucas, re-do the Executor exploding as it nose dives into the death star II. That explosion is perhaps the worst in the saga. It looks as if they ignited a bunch of gasoline from the death star model which destroys the scale illusion. Ironic since one of the best explosions is in that same film when Jabba's sail barge becomes so much scrap. Oh yeah, that was some good pyro-technics.

I'm curious, do you tinker with projects that are "done" but still in your possession? Or once you've sold something would you ask for it back to alter things that have been bothering you, even if the person you sold the painting to likes it the way it is? If you had a painting that made you world famous and was put into the Louvre, would you have the temerity to 20-30 years later demand to have it back so that you could change a few things for the viewing public?

I understand, to an extent, the artistic desire to tinker. But it is nearly impossible for anyone creating something to have the final work come out exactly as they envision it in his or her head, so once you open the door to tinkering, it will never end. For proof I offer you the fact that Lucas made changes initially for the theater re-releases in 94, then again when it went to dvd, then again when they did another version of the dvd, and I rather suspect there will be changes again in bluray. Is he REALLY altering the work to get what he wants? It seems to me he didn't make the changes to get the movies the way he originally wanted, he made them because it wasn't as perfect as in his mind and he's hopelessly trying to get that by fiddling with CGI backgrounds and pointless harmonizing with the prequels. I don't believe the changes he made bring it any closer to what he truly wanted in spirit... he just found a cheap way to put more people on the street and in backgrounds than he could originally. And there is no way anyone can convince me that the altered music at various points is the music he wanted in 1977 but somehow couldn't get.

I'm sorry, but that explanation doesn't hold water with me. I understand where the drive comes from, but I think the hardest thing for any artist is to know when to say enough is enough and just stop. Just look at Chinese Democracy the Guns'n'Roses album... there's no way anyone can tell me that album truly NEEDED the 10+ years of tinkering it got... and that is what separates great, courageous artists from egomaniacal techies. Lucas has a great imagination, but in execution, he's always been something of a failure. The originals succeeded because his imagination shined brightly through the flaws in execution. In painting over the details, he obscured that inspired feel.