Fantasy vs Science Fiction: A Poll

[psikeyhackr]

Anyone who reads sci/fi or sci/fantasy,expecting it to be fact rather than fiction,is in for a disappointment.

It depends on what you mean by that. I started reading SF in the 60s while the space programwas going.

Obviously no one expected any of the details of any SF story to match any real Moon landing, the event itself was a classic SF trope. In an interview after the Moon landing Isaac Asimov talked about the huge number of SF stories about the event, but he said none included television transmissions from the Moon so millions of people could watch on Earth. So any a way reality beat fiction.

The technology we are using to discuss this subject could be regarded as exceeding the expectations of some science fiction. The problem is are we doing anywhere near what we could with it.

psik

 

[althea]

You make a good point,psik.
I'm sure we're not using using our technology to anything near it's capabilities.
I still haven't got over the thrill of having a computer in my home that puts the world at my finger tips.

 

[J-Sun]

A quick peak at the Smithsonian website informs me of several inventions inspired by Science Fiction (sub, helicopter, cell phones, etc).
Don't know if you'd call "Star Trek" good sci-fi or not, but it did inspire some scientists to make things based off of what they saw on the show.
As far as Fantasy goes, it seems exceedingly difficult to bring magic (or magical animals) to real-life. And given what goes on in those novels, you'd have to be pretty damn crazy to even want to. There's no way you'll ever fit that Dragonlance in your garage...

As Tom Purdom said, "Nobody ever became a wizard because they read fantasy. But plenty of people have become physicists and biologists because they read science fiction."

 

[Ray McCarthy]

Moon so millions of people could watch on Earth. So any a way reality beat fiction.

Then (1968 orbit, landing in 1969) who would have believed it would all end inside four years? Last mission ended 19th December 1972!

 

[Ray McCarthy]

But plenty of people have become physicists and biologists because they read science fiction."

Some have. I think that's over rated.
Also we are tortured with stupid Junk because of people thought the SF was a blueprint.

 

[psikeyhackr]

Then (1968 orbit, landing in 1969) who would have believed it would all end inside four years? Last mission ended 19th December 1972!

Another Moonwalker just died in February.

James Irwin died on August 8, 1991, of a heart attack. He was 61 years old.
Alan Shepard died on July 21, 1998 at the age of 74.
Pete Conrad died on July 8, 1999 in a motorcycle accident. He was 69.
Neil Armstrong died on August 25, 2012, at age 82.
Ed Mitchell is 84 years old. died 2/4/16


Buzz Aldrin is 86 years old.
John Young is 85 years old.
Alan Bean is now 84 years old. 3/15/32
David Scott is 83 years old.
Gene Cernan is now 82 years old.
Charles Duke is 80 years old.
Harrison Schmitt is 80 years old. geologist

There are only 7 left, all in their 80s.

We should have had drones on the Moon prospecting for about 10 years now. I am not sure there is much point in having people there. But how much information gathering and infrastructure building couldbe done remotely along with justifiable reason for robotic development.

psik

 

[Ray McCarthy]

We should have had drones on the Moon prospecting for about 10 years now. I am not sure there is much point in having people there. But how much information gathering and infrastructure building couldbe done remotely along with justifiable reason for robotic development.

Agree 100%
Same applies to Mars and moons of Jupiter.

 

[psikeyhackr]

Some have. I think that's over rated.
Also we are tortured with stupid Junk because of people thought the SF was a blueprint.

I decided on engineering before I graduated from grade school because of Arthur C. Clarke's A Fall of Moondust. I was debating between mechanical and electrical. Went with electrical.

SF is not like it was in the 60s. Yeah there was stuff as bad as Star Wars but all of SF was not painted with the same silly brush. The science was not regarded as irrelevant. Now there is talk about STEM education for future scientists and engineers when this was done in 1959:

Science fiction as a factor in science education (Gross)
Science fiction as a factor in science education - Gross - 2006 - Science Education - Wiley Online Library

Even some SF which does not itself contain accurate science has a "scientific attitude". I think grade school kids need to develop that even when they don't go for STEM careers themselves. This Global Warming argument emphasizes the problem of science ignorance.

psik

 

[Ray McCarthy]

SF is not like it was in the 60s.

No, it's changed and a lot is really Fantasy dressed as SF, I enjoy it all the same.

I think grade school kids need to develop that even when they don't go for STEM careers themselves.

Yes.
Logic, reasoning and mathematics, especially statistics and probability as we have no intuition for those.

 

[Mirannan]

Off on a tangent somewhat:

I think that one of the factors involved in the continuing popularity of science and engineering (such as it is) among young people is one that would have been laughed at if put into a work of fiction. I speak of Mythbusters.

 

[Brian G Turner]

SF is not like it was in the 60s.

IMO the genre overall has lost its visionary approach. Too much modern SF is little different from "man with a laser gun has adventures in space!". Or is simply derivative of Star Trek. Perhaps that's why science fiction as a genre has shrunk? Meanwhile, even traditional fantasy has been able to expand its boundaries to being something nearer to historical fiction.

 

[Ray McCarthy]

Too much modern SF is little different from "man with a laser gun has adventures in space!". Or is simply derivative of Star Trek. Perhaps that's why science fiction as a genre has shrunk?

I think so. Also a lack of engineers and scientists writing it. I looked at the Hard SF category on Amazon and I struggled to see any, it seemed to all be space opera (which is fun but not remotely hard SF). The other tendency is to latch on to current "buzzwords" in science and technology such as nanotech or genetics or AI then basically have self indulgent "magic" fantasy with these as sources of techo-babble, that's not "hard SF" either.

 

[Brian G Turner]

I forgot to add that there are space operas and general SF I do enjoy. But there are precious few attempting anything visionary, and that leaves a gaping hole in the genre.

And, no, I don't mean engineering manuals by proxy, which would be dull and date quickly - I mean those writers who make a serious attempt to imagine, and predict, what the future might really look like.

It doesn't require a Ph.D to do that - just vision and imagination. But none of the modern big names in SF seem to be trying to use it.

 

[Ray McCarthy]

I mean those writers who make a serious attempt to imagine, and predict, what the future might really look like.

I don't think many where ever trying to do that as main goal, it was mostly a setting for examining characters, social issues etc. It can be a bit self fulfilling too.

It does need a proper knowledge of science, tech and maths, not just extrapolating the media (which often describes developments completely wrong) or you end up with gibberish. Also as well as economics and human motivation.

I agree there is very little "what if" stuff being written.

 

[althea]

My grandson is doing a degree in Astrophysics.He has never read a sci/fi book.

 

[psikeyhackr]

My grandson is doing a degree in Astrophysics.He has never read a sci/fi book.

I will send aliens to abduct him. Outliers cannot be tolerated.

psik

 

[sinister42]

I voted sci fi but the truth is I read mostly cross-genre stuff and "weird" or "slipstream" fiction. China Mieville, Jeff Vandermeer, Neil Gaiman, Lovecraftian fiction (which is sci fi/horror), Pratchett/DNA (sci fi/fantasy/humor), Christopher Moore (whatever the heck his brand of wackiness is). The only pure sci fi I've read in quite a while is the Expanse series. I read the hell out of the classics when I was younger - Asimov, Bradbury, Clarke, Frank Herbert, PKD - but those aren't really my go tos anymore. Although I did recently read The Man in the High Castle by PKD, which is a chilling abstraction of a book (and a hell of a TV series). I also really like noir, but that's neither here nor there.

 

[The Big Peat]

Fantasy for me; it occupies the sweet spot between history and mythology, the two obsessions of my childhood.

 

[psikeyhackr]

Fantasy for me; it occupies the sweet spot between history and mythology, the two obsessions of my childhood.

But what will it be like in 5,000 years if civilization never collapses? 5,000 years with electricity and people look on life without electricity as we look upon the ancient Egyptians. What will happen to mythology by then? Asimov wrote about interstellar civilization where historians argued about the planet of origin. We don't even remember the great horse manure crisis of 1894. ROFL

psik

 

[The Big Peat]

5,000 years into the future sounds like someone else's problem.