Paperback or ebooks?

[Vertigo]

This backs up what @HareBrain is saying though. You are comfortable with the ebook experience but you have been careful to get it right for you. For me, there is no right (I’ve tried several readers now) - paper is the only right. And, yes, there are certain types of paper books I wouldn’t enjoy reading either

Yes, I agree but I was making the point that for other pragmatic reasons I made the effort to adjust. It wasn't particularly easy at first but, as I say, for other reasons I persisted and eventually it became the natural environment for my reading. This is also why I believe that paper books are ultimately doomed, other than maybe some types of art style books, in that the younger generations are growing up fully accustomed to doing most of their reading on electronic screens of one sort or another and eventually there will be few left with attachments/preferences for paper. I make no judgement as to whether this is a good or bad thing or how long it will take but I do believe it to be an inevitability going into the future.

 

[Jo Zebedee]

Yes, I agree but I was making the point that for other pragmatic reasons I made the effort to adjust. It wasn't particularly easy at first but, as I say, for other reasons I persisted and eventually it became the natural environment for my reading. This is also why I believe that paper books are ultimately doomed, other than maybe some types of art style books, in that the younger generations are growing up fully accustomed to doing most of their reading on electronic screens of one sort or another and eventually there will be few left with attachments/preferences for paper. I make no judgement as to whether this is a good or bad thing or how long it will take but I do believe it to be an inevitability going into the future.

As you’ll know, I run a bookstore and a lot of people say this about young people - but it’s not borne out by the reality. Part of this is driven by both Instagram and TikTok which have a huge and young base of book lovers (check out Booktok - it’s great) who read paper over electronic. They see it as a break from the screen time. Honestly, the people who apologetically tell me they now use a kindle (not that I’m bothered) are mostly our generation and above. The young devour pretty books. And I do mean devour.

 

[Vertigo]

As you’ll know, I run a bookstore and a lot of people say this about young people - but it’s not borne out by the reality. Part of this is driven by both Instagram and TikTok which have a huge and young base of book lovers (check out Booktok - it’s great) who read paper over electronic. They see it as a break from the screen time. Honestly, the people who apologetically tell me they now use a kindle (not that I’m bothered) are mostly our generation and above. The young devour pretty books. And I do mean devour.

Well you may be right but I know loads of kids reading books on smart phones. And, to be fair, the ebook market has only been seriously going for around 13-14 years (first kindle was released in 2007), so it's honestly incredibly early for anyone to make sound predictions. However I do stick to my argument but without a timescale - it could be 20/50/100 years but I'm convinced it will happen. And one of the great drivers will be the massive growth of self published books which never go to print. But as I say it's very early days for any kind of informed opinion on such a young technology.

 

[HareBrain]

The young devour pretty books.

Are you using "pretty" here to mean something more than what would have attracted us to a book (e.g. eye-catching cover)?

 

[Jo Zebedee]

Are you using "pretty" here to mean something more than what would have attracted us to a book (e.g. eye-catching cover)?

pretty as in nice books, whether binding or with illustrations. Vintage read also popular.

 

[chongjasmine]

I prefer ebooks.

 

[JunkMonkey]

And one of the great drivers will be the massive growth of self published books which never go to print.

It could be argued that, given the abysmal quality of most self-published books, being printed on paper and bound in an actual physical volume could come to be seen as a mark of assurance that the thing has been read, edited, and proofread by someone other than the author's mother.

(Mind you having said that
- A: My mother is a bloody good proofreader
and
- B: The last real paperback self-published book I attempted to read had an 'Editing and Proofreading' credit on the front matter copyright and printing history page, and, despite it being a second edition, had a spelling mistake on page one.)

 

[Astro Pen]

The e-book is a business model, not an art form.

 

[Vertigo]

It could be argued that, given the abysmal quality of most self-published books, being printed on paper and bound in an actual physical volume could come to be seen as a mark of assurance that the thing has been read, edited, and proofread by someone other than the author's mother.

(Mind you having said that
- A: My mother is a bloody good proofreader
and
- B: The last real paperback self-published book I attempted to read had an 'Editing and Proofreading' credit on the front matter copyright and printing history page, and, despite it being a second edition, had a spelling mistake on page one.)

I have a fairly similar filter: if it only has an Amazon ASIN number and no ISBN then I'm unlikely to read it unless I have either a personal recommendation or it has good reviews from reviewers I trust on Goodreads. ASIN only pretty much guarantees it is self published. An ISBN is generally only obtained if going to print.

 

[Montero]

Well produced self-published authors include

Victoria Goddard
Kim Watts
Belinda White
T Kingfisher (brings out some of her own, some trad published)
KB Spangler
Lois McMaster Bujold.
Diane Duane
Eva St John

There are sometimes a few more spelling mistakes than in a traditional published book, but by few I mean one or two per chapter. And I do see the odd spelling mistake in trad published books from time to time.

 

[Bick]

Book definition from Merriam-Webster

a set of written, printed, or blank sheets bound together between a front and back cover

eBook definition from Bick

an oxymoron

 

[Bick]

Well produced self-published authors include

Lois McMaster Bujold.

Bujold? As in, the best selling author published by Baen Books, and HarperCollins?

 

[paeng]

Hardcover for canonical literature (and generally available in that format for some editions, e.g., Everyman, Library of America), paperback for the same but not available in hardcover, and anything else e-book or borrowed.

An example of a list of canonical lit:

Bloom. Western Canon

 

[psikeyhackr]

The e-book is a business model, not an art form.

Writers who consider themselves to be artists should not allow their works to be produced as e-books.

 

[Yozh]

I'm old enough that my kids are teenagers. They still read really a lot of print books. Books (paper books) are what they ask for for gifts. They devour all kinds of digital media--webtoons, youtube, arcane blogs--, but for long-form novels seems like they prefer paper. Myself, I have read some e-books, but it's honestly just not a format I think about much. When I was in a book club, if I couldn't find a paper copy of a book I'd read the e-book. But generally I prefer to just browse the shelves at the library or book store and see what strikes my fancy.

 

[Montero]

Bujold? As in, the best selling author published by Baen Books, and HarperCollins?

Her Penric novellas started self-published. Looking on Amazon they quote a literary agent as the publisher, but the way she talks about them on the blog, they are essentially self-published - she asks for readers to promote them if they enjoy them as there is no publishing house marketing machinery behind them.
Quite a few trad published authors are now bringing out a mix of self-published and trad published. Barbara Hambly is another one - she puts out what she calls "Further Adventures" on Smashwords which are novellas following up on characters from her earlier fantasies. I love them.

 

[JunkMonkey]

Her Penric novellas started self-published. Looking on Amazon they quote a literary agent as the publisher, but the way she talks about them on the blog, they are essential self-published - she asks for readers to promote them if they enjoy them as there is no publishing house marketing machinery behind them.
Quite a few trad published authors are now bringing out a mix of self-published and trad published. Barbara Hambly is another one - she puts out what she calls "Further Adventures" on Smashwords which are novellas following up on characters from her earlier fantasies. I love them.

Christopher Priest does this too. The real Christopher Priest not the comic book guy.

 

[Vertigo]

And I do see the odd spelling mistake in trad published books from time to time.

I've been seeing this more and more recently, which feels a little like the beginning of the end! If traditional publishers can't distinguish their products from self published products then I don't really see what relevance they have, nor do I see much of a future for them.

I hate typos and other editorial errors in books as they pull me out of the story every time and it is one of my biggest grumbles about self published work, though not the only one by any means. To some extent I can understand that getting their work properly proof read is maybe something a self published author might struggle to afford. However, this is not an excuse the traditional publishers can claim.

To be honest though, when I make something, I like to take pride in my work. If I paint a wall I'll be careful with the details; I'll mask the edges so the paint doesn't go where it's not wanted. I don't want my work to be spoiled by messy finishing. If I wrote a book I would be appalled if I was publishing it and taking money for it with it still filled with messy finishing like editorial errors. If I buy a shirt I don't expect to find it has fraying seams and if I buy a book I expect it to be equally well finished.

 

[JunkMonkey]

If I buy a shirt I don't expect to find it has fraying seams and if I buy a book I expect it to be equally well finished.

And if you buy a shirt like that you have grounds for complaint and a refund - certainly in the UK. If something is not fit for purpose or misrepresented when sold then you have a good case. But with a book? I guess if it suddenly turns into Serbo-Croat half-way through, or huge chunks are missing, or it literally falls to pieces as you read it you might but other wise - forget it.

 

[Montero]

An author I follow, Kim Watts, who does rather good urban (and rural) fantasy detective stories, does a pretty good job on the manuscript - and once she thinks it is ready, she hands out ARCs a few weeks before publication to her mailing list and says "please send me all typos". I'm three quarters of the way through her latest and have found six - so not bad at all. They were mainly things like missing an occasional word, "go" where I'd expect "go to" or the like. No spelling mistakes at all. She'll publish it in a few weeks when all the ARCs have written back in. Quite a few self-pub do a final polish request read to their mailing list. I'm happy with that - I'll do it if I have time, or wait for the official copy if I don't.

What I am really liking with self-pub is the variable lengths of the books, from novellas being more possible, to ones that are extremely long - but you get to find out what happened to absolutely everybody in the multi-character cast. With the latter I sometimes get thrown, because I have years of my expectations being trained in expecting a certain arc to a story from what is done in trad pub, but I come up for air, plunge back in and often on the second read am fine with it. I find it satisfying when lots of loose ends are tied off - some trad books leave me going "but what happened to so and so, I liked them best". Self-pub makes it possible to write side branch novellas, or what happened next novellas.