The Hardy Boys and Nancy Drew

[AnyaKimlin]

@AnyaKimlin
I presume so. Very different situation though in those days, beginning of 20th C.

I would happily write one for a few quid. 170 pages writing to a formula wouldn't take long.

 

[AnyaKimlin]

I remember the 'Famous Five' was it British? Were they the ones had a parrot along on their adventures? I remember really liking them a lot.

No Famous Five had Timmy the dog.

The Adventure Series was Kiki the parrot.

 

[Ray McCarthy]

No Famous Five had Timmy the dog.
The Adventure Series was Kiki the parrot.

Also the Five Finder Outers was brilliant. It had Fatty and a dog.
I think all three of those brilliant. Though I think "Five Go to Smuggler's Top" is my favourite. I think the first Enid Blyton I'd read. Shortly after read Biggles. I'd read Wizard of Oz and Bobbsey Twins first. I don't think we had any of the Kiddies Blyton books growing up, like Noddy. My kids had some of those.

How did Enid Blyton do it?
List of 762 books by Enid Blyton (1897–1968)

I'll never catch up. I've left it too late starting.

 

[Teresa Edgerton]

I always thought that after a certain point the Nancy Drew books lost much of their sparkle. It seems that may have something to do with the fact that Mildred Benson didn't write them.

But goodness, she was prolific. That $125 she was receiving at the beginning seems paltry, but at the time it would go a long way. $500 for the later books at the time she was writing those seems less generous. Bus she did write them quickly and maintained a career in journalism while she was writing them, so perhaps it does fairly represent the amount of time she spent working on them . . . had she also received royalties.

These work-for-hire arrangements have always struck me as unfair to the writers, but the authors do understand what sort of compensation they will be receiving. I've known writers who have worked under such contracts and they were not people who were stupid or naive.

 

[AnyaKimlin]

I would be happy with £250 for one now. It's a regular second income and if someone else is editing...

 

[Dave]

The history of who wrote which when is nearly a good story in its own write. There is no Franklin Dixon or Carolyn Keene.
Stratamyer had other quite readable series too.

I never read Nancy Drew. Nancy Drew was definitely for girls and my sister read read those. I also inherited a big stack of Hardy Boys books from either my father or else someone from his generation (possible from a combination of both.) I read them all avidly, though I cannot remember any particular story now. Later I was bought some newer Hardy Boys books, which I do remember, despite having more modern stories (one concerned a jet flight) were just not as good. It didn't occur to me that Franklin W Dixon wasn't a real person even though he would have had to have been quite ancient by that time. I also never saw any TV series though that would explain the revival.

I never read Famous Five myself, but I did read them to my daughter and they are surprisingly good for being so mass produced. I also never read Biggles, Just William, Gerald Durrell, Willard Price, or any other children's staples. I read the Lone Pine series by Malcolm Saville, then I started reading John Wydham and John Christopher and never looked back.

 

[Ray McCarthy]

It seems that may have something to do with the fact that Mildred Benson didn't write them.

But goodness, she was prolific. That $125 she was receiving at the beginning seems paltry, but at the time it would go a long way. $500 for the later books at the time she was writing those seems less generous.

It's as well Mildred Benson and Enid Blyton didn't live to see J.K. Rowlings income from ONLY SEVEN books ... Less than 1/100th of Enid Blyton's output, Enid Blyton was the most popular Children's Author in the UK for maybe 20 years. It didn't make her wealthy like JK.

In 2004, Forbes named Rowling as the first person to become a U.S.-dollar billionaire by writing books, the second-richest female entertainer and the 1,062nd richest person in the world.

If asked whether I suffer from the condition commonly known as JK Rowling Envy, I can't say no.
Like any other writer who is not JK Rowling, I can't say no because my teeth are so tightly gritted in a smile of good sportsmanship that tiny fragments of enamel are given off into the atmosphere, and if I opened my mouth any further a long howl of anguish would be released, tapering into a convulsive whimper, punctuated with deliriously mumbled statistics. 325 million copies. 65 languages. A thousand million dollars. A million billion roubles. Gazillion fantabulon megayen...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/magazine/6919618.stm

 

[Teresa Edgerton]

I would be happy with £250 for one now. It's a regular second income and if someone else is editing...

And don't forget that they didn't have to come up with the plot. Although I am not sure that would always make it easier. In some cases it would, but in others being handed a plot that was perhaps not so well-thought out as the boss thought and trying to make it work could be frustrating.

That quote is priceless (and refreshingly honest), Ray.

 

[AnyaKimlin]

And don't forget that they didn't have to come up with the plot. Although I am not sure that would always make it easier. In some cases it would, but in others being handed a plot that was perhaps not so well-thought out as the boss thought and trying to make it work could be frustrating.

.

The Aztec Warrior I think was one of those. The more recent series I find better written.

But I could write a couple a month and it would be reasonably well paid job I could do at home.

 

[Teresa Edgerton]

The Nancy Drew Books were (apparently) 50-75,000 words in length and she wrote them in 2 to 6 weeks. I wonder, if I reread them now, if I would find them well-written or not.

Do you really think you could produce books of that length in 2 weeks and be satisfied with the result, Anya?

 

[AnyaKimlin]

The Nancy Drew Books were (apparently) 50-75,000 words in length and she wrote them in 2 to 6 weeks. I wonder, if I reread them now, if I would find them well-written or not.

Do you really think you could produce books of that length in 2 weeks and be satisfied with the result, Anya?

I wrote a sit com pilot in 24 hours.

Of similar standard to Nancy Drew/Hardy Boys if I didn't have to come up with the plot then yes. The advantage of the syndicate is it isn't me dictating the standard or my name on the cover. One thing my BBC training is helping with is writing to a brief and style.

 

[Extollager]

My memory (of my limited experience) is that public libraries were unwilling to buy the Hardy Boys or Nancy Drew books in the mid-1960s at least. My mom, who worked in a public library for a time, may have told me that the librarians didn't think these books were worthy of purchase, or perhaps she said that the librarians didn't want to invest in these proliferating series. At any rate, I wondered if others who liked these books these many years ago also found that the books weren't available in public libraries.

Were they perhaps available in some school libraries?

I don't want to start here a big discussion about changes in the attitudes of librarians -- please, let's have a separate thread for that if someone wants to go there. But I am struck by the irony of librarian unwillingness to get books like these, when today they may be stocking movie- and tv-tie ins, DVDs of TV shows, computer games, etc. to try to attract kids.

 

[Ursa major]

I've only read one** each from the Hardy Boys series and the a Famous Five series, The Secret of the Lost Tunnel and Five Go to Smuggler's Top respectively, so it's hard to really compare them (not made easier by the fact that I read both of them as a child). I think the locations*** of each book are what I can recall best (well, recall at all, really). Oh, and "atom crackers" and a blimp from the Hardy Boys volume.


** - I think they were both hand-me-downs from older cousins, but I may be mistaken.

*** - The Deep South setting of The Secret of the Lost Tunnel was, as you might imagine, far from my own experience of the world. (According to Wiki, there are two versions of the book. I suspect I read the original one.)

 

[Ray McCarthy]

public libraries were unwilling to buy the Hardy Boys or Nancy Drew books in the mid-1960s at least.

From what I read the libraries in USA had ALWAYS been unwilling to stock Stratemeyer series even in 1920s citing quality.
UK Libraries and Schools didn't like Enid Blyton, but perhaps different reasons. She was regarded as subversive and anti-Authority! Ha!
I have no idea what UK or Irish Schools thought of Hardy Boys/Nancy Drew, but in 1980s to 1990s the local Irish library stocked them. Though probably the updated versions.

 

[Teresa Edgerton]

As one who has haunted school and public libraries from childhood, I have never seen Nancy Drew or the Hardy Boys in a library of any sort.

The syndicate probably didn't mind. I know publishers of children's books make a lot of their sales to libraries, but in the case of Nancy Drew, the Hardy Boys, and the Bobbsey Twins, the books were so inexpensive and so popular, maybe they sold better without the libraries.

 

[TheDustyZebra]

Wow, I've hardly seen a library without Nancy Drew and the Hardy Boys! It's where I got all of Nancy Drew and the ones of the Hardy Boys that were published after my brothers were too old for them. Both of my libraries here still have them, and the Bobbsey Twins too. Another of my favorite series, the Happy Hollisters, seems to have gone by the wayside over the years, and Trixie Belden, but they never get rid of those others. I was reading them in the mid-70s, as a point of reference.

 

[AnyaKimlin]

Like TDZ I got mine from the library. Enid Blyton as well. However she disappeared for awhile whilst any racism, spanking and kinky references were removed (Dick and Fanny became Rick and Frances)

Our local library also had Babysitter's Club

They also still stocked Panels Brown. A children's author who wrote amazing girls but fared less well over time.

 

[chongjasmine]

I enjoyed the hardy boys books in my teenage years.

 

[Extollager]

I've some remarks on one of the Hardy Boys books, The Disappearing Floor, here:

https://www.sffchronicles.com/threads/537466/page-6#post-1940039

The Hardy Boys book is written to be read by readers who haven't developed "reading skills" -- and imagination -- needed for books that have more to offer.

 

[AnyaKimlin]

I've some remarks on one of the Hardy Boys books, The Disappearing Floor, here.

The Hardy Boys book is written to be read by readers who haven't developed "reading skills" -- and imagination -- needed for books that have more to offer.

I guess at 39 I should give up trying to get good at this reading lark.

I was about nine when I read this one. In the same year I had the reading skills to tackle "A Clockwork Orange"; "Gulliver's Travels" and "Hotel du Lac" although the latter was ridiculously dull. "Wuthering Heights" was a disaster because of the whole Heathcliff being a cartoon orange cat.

Maybe I just lack imagination or maybe like most children I do not need a writer to do the imagining for me.