Crowdfunding...

[Jo Zebedee]

okay, I hear about this a lot these days. Kickstarter et. Becky Chambers accessed it to complete The long way to a small, angry planet.

If I'm right, a writer seeks funding to complete a project. So, anyone ever done one or thought about it. If so why and how did it go?

Anyone supported one? Why and did it work out?

I'm dubious. It seems like something for nothing to me. It also seems like something - the writing - I should be funding myself as part of my risk in trying to becomea writer. Am I naive? Should I be outlining my new frontier fantasy series and seeing if someone will pay me to write the darn thing? (Cheques can be forwarded to my usual account....)

 

[ratsy]

Hey Jo, I don't know a lot about it but I talked to my brother about it who has known a lot of people who use it. He is an artist and many friends have done kickstarters for comics, movies, cartoons, collector cards, and all that stuff. I guess some big video games have been done with it too, into the millions? (this is here-say, i have no proof)

The Baby Shoes anthology i was in did a kickstarted campaign to get funded too, and I they got 2,800+ https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1727584460/baby-shoes-celebrating-flash-fiction

I came in late as a story contributor and wasn't there to witness any of it going down.

I think it can be a good way to get a product to market, as long as others buy in to what you're doing. I honestly don't see anything wrong with it, and can understand why people would do it.

I am more of the mind-set to self fund projects if possible at this time, but I would be interested to see someone from here do a project on it so we can all learn from it.

 

[Tim Murray]

okay, I hear about this a lot these days. Kickstarter et. Becky Chambers accessed it to complete The long way to a small, angry planet.

If I'm right, a writer seeks funding to complete a project. So, anyone ever done one or thought about it. If so why and how did it go?

Anyone supported one? Why and did it work out?

I'm dubious. It seems like something for nothing to me. It also seems like something - the writing - I should be funding myself as part of my risk in trying to becomea writer. Am I naive? Should I be outlining my new frontier fantasy series and seeing if someone will pay me to write the darn thing? (Cheques can be forwarded to my usual account....)

This is my first try. What an education! I researched both Idiegogo and Kickstarter before I started mine. I saw many examples that did succeed and a lot that did not. When one has little self-funding to forward a project, what do you do? The answer lies with the individual. Mine was to try. Up to now, it has been a flop! It does not always work. I am hoping that with the latest additions and tweak's, it might accomplish something. I'll let you know when it is finished.

 

[Overread]

Kickstarter is a great way to bring niche products to the market which otherwise might find it hard to get a private investor on board. Basically it often looks at items which fit into a niche and thus might not always have a mass market appeal which would attract regular investment. The other bonus is that you gain investment without having any loss of share in company control nor any repayments with interest added on.

There are some points to consider though:
1) If you are an "unknown name" and cannot get a "known name" to help your campaign chances are you will want a project closer to completion. A lot of webcomics are an ideal example where they've already got the comic itself written but need the KS to finance going to print.
The idea here is that basically you're offering a very SAFE investment option. You're basically just getting the finished product to market and as such backers are more willing to part with money because you've got the product ready. Essentially you're using it rather like a pre-ordering system.

2) If you're further back you want to show things that you've done - other products/projects that were successful; you want to speak about your skills, the challenges and be honest. You want a meaningful and workable time-scale and you also want to be regular in communication to the backers you get.

3) Backer communication is KEY. They must be treated like investors and kept in the loop; fail to do so and you will lose a lot of support VERY fast. At best this might mean you've got a bit of an annoyed group of backers; at worse it could turn the community toxic and once that happens its a huge undertaking to repair that damage and toxicity within the community.

4) You advertise the KS BEFORE you launch it. Many fail on this score and simply do not advertise and as a result they never get funding; others try to start once the KS has begun and quickly find that whilst that by the time the KS comes to the end and the marketing is working its all over and they are either not funded or they've hit a much lower score than they otherwise could have. You also cannot trust your backers to advertise for you - you must do it yourself.

5) Plan your KS well; you want to ideally have it so that you can get financed and go to production with as low a cost as possible. The idea being that your first "target" to get funded and go into production is at a sensible low point so that you will get backers on board faster. Basically projects gain traction on backers once they are "funded" as then people feel that its going to be a reality not just a "maybe".
Generally if you're not funded within a week of the launch you are not going to get funded or you'll do so marginally.

6) Backer reward are a big thing; though of course can increase costs as well. So you have to balance out the rewards; having several options is a really neat way to get more money out of individual backers so that you're both getting as many people in the door as you can; but also offering as much as you can to each person.

7) Remember all the numbers must add up; you want excess in each target because you could go over-budget; you need to plan for that. You want reward tiers planned out in advance (even if you don't announce all of them at the start you want them researched and ready to use).

8) Network with other KS projects of similar natures as your own (this might mean similar products or themes - eg fantasy products). Sometimes you can get a successful project to mention your on their KS page which can instantly net you a host of new fans coming over to have a look - free advertising and most only want a return favour from yourself.

9) Remember to look into international postage costs because you are going to have international customers. For a book an ebook could get around this; but physical rewards will need posting. Note this is where networking with other KS projects also helps a lot as there are many shipping options and sometimes you can pool resources to get a cheaper rate.

10) respond to backer questions promptly; keep news fresh and generally manage the community on KS for your project. This takes time - the month of running a KS might well find you running the KS only; of course the more pre-planning you do the easier it will be. Do none at all and you'll be running around like a nutter - plan it all out in advance and you'll find it far less stressful and you'll have time to make proper choices not just throw out ideas/promises and then find later that they are not feasible.

Personally I think that you will find it very hard to get a first book financed through KS. It's rather like photographers getting photo trips financed - people see it as a holiday or in the case of writing a hobby and they are disinclined to pay for that to an unknown person. If you were George RR Martin yeah you could get financed on KS to write a book (granted for him the only book he could get financed to write is another Game of Thrones book - anything else and he'd get a toxic community lash out in seconds).

I would not encourage you to do this unless you could collaborate to have your writing in a collected works by a series of known authors; even one big name could be enough to make it work but you'd need someone with a fan-base on board to get the exposure. Otherwise its too personal a project to likely get funded unless what you're aiming to produce is really outstanding and you can prove it will be to backers.

 

[Ray McCarthy]

I think crowdfunding is fine for something that exists, works, and there is a prototype. I don't believe in it for books, comics, music or even films.

 

[Jo Zebedee]

Thanks, @Overread, that's a great post. It sounds like a lot of work when I could be off writing...

To be clear, I wasn't considering it as an option. I'm far too much of a lone wolf.

 

[ratsy]

Wow Overread. Great post. Do you personally have experience? Sounds like it.

 

[Jeremy M. Gottwig]

Big ditto on everything Overread said.

I've supported a little under 70 Kickstarters with a focus on creative projects (books, video games, stage). I also am friends with a writer/illustrator, who had a successful KS that made a bit over 20k.

I think the biggest thing to remember is that you need to prepare way before the KS launches. Get your interviews lined up. If you have other author / artist / etc friends, ask them to advocate on their blogs, social networks, etc. My writer/illustrator friend requested work by fellow artists months in advance, which he drizzled into KS and over social networks to help keep attention on his project.

One interesting anecdote. I supported Obduction (by the makers of Myst). It wasn't looking great during the last 48 hours. Backers went crazy requesting plugs from celebrities, and they finally got one from Neil Patrick Harris over Twitter. The money poured in, and the KS was successful. Moral of the story: don't be afraid to ask the heavy hitters for a plug. You might get it.

 

[Foxbat]

Here's what I don't get - most books don't generate enough cash for a writer to make a living and - that being the case - how is any author likely to repay that investment?

Give me a finished product to look at and (if I think it's good enough) I might consider investing in it. Otherwise forget it.

Of course, they could always go on Dragon's Den...

 

[thaddeus6th]

I share your view, Jo.

A videogame (for example) can cost a large amount to fund and has a prolonged development cycle during which (if they're going for something nearer the top end than charmingly retro) dozens of people, maybe more, will be working on it.

A book is largely the work of one person, entombed in a room for 300+ days a year by themselves.

Videogames can offer alphas to play (early, developmental versions), or merchandise, or early access when the game is done. Hard to see what a writer can offer as early versions will have both spoilers and could change.

 

[Ray McCarthy]

A videogame (for example) can cost a large amount to fund

It needs very many many more artists than a comic.
It costs much more than a budget movie!
Unless you manage to invent the next falling blocks game or something. We aren't talking about breakout or Asteroids. Even an animated 2D click and point adventure needs an immense amount of artwork and voice acting.

Even to employ a ghost writer and editor to create a book from an idea is a tiny fraction of cost of a new electronic product or video game.

 

[Jo Zebedee]

It needs very many many more artists than a comic.
It costs much more than a budget movie!
Unless you manage to invent the next falling blocks game or something. We aren't talking about breakout or Asteroids. Even an animated 2D click and point adventure needs an immense amount of artwork and voice acting.

Even to employ a ghost writer and editor to create a book from an idea is a tiny fraction of cost of a new electronic product or video game.

One of the arguments put forwards for crowdfunding books is that the author needs to eat etc - so, essentially, paying a writer to take time off their main job to write.

 

[Kylara]

I've backed a few kickstarters for various reasons. One was a well known comic who had come up with a hilarious card game idea but obviously needed funding to make it happen, as their webcomic money was rightly pit back into the webcomic. They got funding in about 2 days and ended up at something ridiculous like 400% funded.

Another one I funded at the other end of the spectrum was a hydroponic fish tank filter. Unknown guys, but know a lot about fishtanks and work in the industry had developed a company aimed at hydroponics. Useful in all sorts of commercial aspects and great for people who want a less chemically tank. They were upfront about how it was designed and they had a prototype etc but the money would be for development and then the tiers were various things with the top few being a full minibars set up with filter etc. Took the poor guys over a year and we'll past their original deadline as manufacturing is a tricky business, especially when you try to be economic friendly and have quite a tricky compression of tank and filter. They kept everyone updated and in a friendly manner, explaining how they underestimated timescales and everything got shipped in the end, international backers getting their stuff a couple of months after. Big success and they recently ran another kickstarter for an even tinier tank aimed at schools to learn about nitrogen cycle, fish, hydroponics etc, with a smaller filter (the first one was pretty damn small and could still do 100gallons an hour). I think they did well, especially with their updates, although they did get slower and slower to update towards the middle but by that point we all understood how hard they were working around their commercial part increasing and their updates got less frequent but longer.

So unless you have an innovative project, are already well known for something, or are fabulous at marketing you have a lot of work to get noticed. I would also say the tiered rewards are essential. You want high medium and low. Your high has to be brilliant, but your medium and low is where you get your money. Low are often just pictures or signed things or badges, and medium tends to be copies of whatever in various forms. My OH is funding a video game and they are almost done with it (about 3 years on) but they have done videos showing dev and their tier levels are brilliant. Dev art, signed dev art, alpha access, beta access, full game, custom skins, various in game bonuses, t-shirts, badges, personalised thank you videos.

Books are harder to ones I find do better are ones with good reward tiers and illustrated books as they tend to offer certain prints as rewards. Lots offer to put your name on their stuff as a thank you, or give you personalised signed copies of whatever they are making. (the card game mentioned earlier did that)

So fabulous idea, but really really needs thinking through and heavily planning pre launch. If you don't make your target you don't get any of the money.

 

[Foxbat]

One of the arguments put forwards for crowdfunding books is that the author needs to eat etc - so, essentially, paying a writer to take time off their main job to write.

Most writers need another source of income and this idea of somebody else paying for something that they're not being forced to do comes across as sheer laziness. We all need to eat and, if we write, then we all find ways to make the time, make the money and make the submissions.

Why should I fund somebody to do something I have to do myself?

 

[Ray McCarthy]

One of the arguments put forwards for crowdfunding books

Yes, but it's a poor one. On a level of people trying to crowdfund a holiday or a wedding, essentially selfish. This is why some crowdfunding sites require a prototype.

 

[Ray McCarthy]

a hilarious card game idea

Yes, games are valid. A prototype is easy to do and doesn't need funding. But even a pilot production can have a huge NRE setup cost. I'd not support crowd funding of a card or board game with no prototype and rules done. Cereal packets, paper, glue, markers even if you don't have a colour laser printer or ink jet (Brother Colour laser is really cheap, duplex and can produce a set of prototype cards, double sided ready to cut up).

I have friend that's a game guru, he beta reads and may turn a game in one of my SF books into a game. But he'll do a prototype, have his gamer nerd friends play it, tweak the rules etc before he'd ever go near crowd funding. Likely I'll self publish the book first as it's niche SF (which itself is more niche than Fantasy) and we'll have blogs, websites etc.

 

[Stephen Palmer]

What Ray said.

 

[Stephen Palmer]

One of the arguments put forwards for crowdfunding books is that the author needs to eat etc - so, essentially, paying a writer to take time off their main job to write.

People need to realise that if they're going to make the jump from writer to author they're going to have to accept having a day job, with all that entails.

 

[Kylara]

The card game was fully fleshed out and they had designed made and played it. But producing a 75 card pack is not cheap! So it was all prototype and the funding was to mass produce

 

[Phyrebrat]

I've only got experience of one KS project and that is a book. But it is slightly different. The director of The Babadook had so many requests on producing the pop up book used in the movie that she started a campaign.

After seeing the movie last year I pledged and now - a year later - the book is nearly finished (a run of 2000) were made, and the two I paid for will be shipped in January 2016.

It's been a very interesting process to observe.

pH