Patrick Stewart returns as Picard to lead new Star Trek series

[Anthoney]

I am continually vexed over the fact that those who are purportedly fans of Star Trek and Star Wars do nothing but put down/complain about everything produced in those particular universes.

You find a disparaging comment by me and all of the sudden I'm lumped in with those who "do nothing but put down/complain about everything produced in those particular universes. "

Stroll over to the Discovery thread and you'll find good stuff. At this point in my life there's only one thing that makes me mad enough to fight to the death over. It's not politics or religion. It's the Kelvin Time Line. As one of the original knight guardians of Star Trek and winner of the 1980 GenCon Star Trek trivia contest, it is my sacred duty to defend the original (Prime) time with my last breath.

 

[BAYLOR]

View attachment 46181

You find a disparaging comment by me and all of the sudden I'm lumped in with those who "do nothing but put down/complain about everything produced in those particular universes. "

Stroll over to the Discovery thread and you'll find good stuff. At this point in my life there's only one thing that makes me mad enough to fight to the death over. It's not politics or religion. It's the Kelvin Time Line. As one of the original knight guardians of Star Trek and winner of the 1980 GenCon Star Trek trivia contest, it is my sacred duty to defend the original (Prime) time with my last breath.

When Im the last Defender of Kevelinlot and I have nothing but good things to say about the Kelvin time and what it s brought to Star Trek .

hopes Roger Zelazny isn't watching. from the hearafter

 

[Vince W]

*dramatic sigh*

I am continually vexed over the fact that those who are purportedly fans of Star Trek and Star Wars do nothing but put down/complain about everything produced in those particular universes.

Thank goodness there are enough of us out here who actually appreciate the efforts of those that continue to produce stories from our beloved universes!

ROLL ON, CBS!

 

[Cathbad]

*Injured by Anthoney's spear, but not out, I speak haltingly.*

My quotes were not meant as accusations, but as examples, Dragonslayer.

Personally, I have not yet seen a series or movie in the Star Trek multiverse that I did not like. And, considering the money they made, I think I have a lot of company.

 

[Cathbad]

Probably.

 

[Vince W]

*Injured by Anthoney's spear, but not out, I speak haltingly.*

My quotes were not meant as accusations, but as examples, Dragonslayer.

Personally, I have not yet seen a series or movie in the Star Trek multiverse that I did not like. And, considering the money they made, I think I have a lot of company.

Can you quote any of the lines from any of the Bra'Trek films? I can't.

The Prime line films are another matter altogether.

 

[Cathbad]

Can you quote any of the lines from any of the Bra'Trek films? I can't.

The Prime line films are another matter altogether.

I can't quote lines from most of the movies I watch!

 

[Dave]

At this point in my life there's only one thing that makes me mad enough to fight to the death over. It's not politics or religion. It's the Kelvin Time Line. As one of the original knight guardians of Star Trek and winner of the 1980 GenCon Star Trek trivia contest, it is my sacred duty to defend the original (Prime) time with my last breath.

I role play online on a TOS Movie era Starfleet Ship and I'd go even further. I continually have to stop people going on "Away Teams" rather than "Landing Parties." I have to stop people wanting to visit the Ship's Counsellor (!) and to meet alien races that I've never heard of. They want to fly at ridiculously fast Warp speeds and think Klingons are our friends. On top of that, women are captains of ships and don't wear regulation mini-dresses. What is the world coming too?

Back to this subject - I am confident that it will be good. All my misgivings about Discovery were proved wrong. However, I stand by what I said about the end of the season because I think they threw out all the good things.

 

[BAYLOR]

Bringing Warhammer 40k into this argument is dirty pool .

 

[Anthoney]

I role play online on a TOS Movie era Starfleet Ship

If you play in the TOS movie era then women could wear skirts or pants. Women could also be captains. The very first female captain was animated. The first live person was seen in Star Trek IV. Unless you're not going that high.

I mostly agree about the end of Discovery. Those last 3 episode were added late. It's like the decided they didn't like the Klingon War setting and just did away with it. I hope for the best with the new direction.

 

[Vince W]

I role play online on a TOS Movie era Starfleet Ship and I'd go even further. I continually have to stop people going on "Away Teams" rather than "Landing Parties." I have to stop people wanting to visit the Ship's Counsellor (!) and to meet alien races that I've never heard of. They want to fly at ridiculously fast Warp speeds and think Klingons are our friends. On top of that, women are captains of ships and don't wear regulation mini-dresses. What is the world coming too?

I play Star Fleet Battles. The only good Klingon is the superheated gas left over from their warp engines going critical from a well placed photon torpedo.

 

[ctg]

Bringing Warhammer 40k into this argument is dirty pool .

How would a normal ST space ship do against Imperial warships? I know they have a lot more speed and warp capability but I fear that ST would lose big time. Orcs methods would certainly make StarFleet officers to change their underwear. Out of everything I think Borgs would lose big time against the Tyranids.

[/offtopic]

[ontopic]

I hope Patric shows Picard as a grumpy old man rather than a smiling head of the StarFleet Academy. Making him to smile could be whole arc on itself.

 

[Dave]

*dramatic sigh*

I am continually vexed over the fact that those who are purportedly fans of Star Trek and Star Wars do nothing but put down/complain about everything produced in those particular universes.

I really can't let this stand once again since you have quoted me in your list of transgressors. It may be true of some fans, but it simply isn't the case with me (nor very probably many others - I can't talk for them.)

One can be critical of decisions, designs etc. and, in this case, direction of stories, while still using/enjoying the product overall. It is also what people do on forums, so if you don't like that then you really ought to stop reading forums and getting yourself vexed.

Nevertheless, it is not a good idea to produce any old tat of anything just to have more of it. High quantity does not equal high quality, and they do need to protect the Star Trek brand. Dilution of a brand is a very bad thing with any product or service.

I thought Discovery (as a whole) was great, as you are well aware, and I thoroughly enjoyed it, despite my pre-production misgivings over the changes in writers and production staff that all came to nothing. That is why I am totally confident this will also be good.

That doesn't stop me from wondering that with such a huge canvas to paint upon, why they go back and return to same periods, and the same characters. I do agree with one point you made though - this is a new series set in the future beyond Voyager, which is indeed, one of the things we asked for in previous threads here.

 

[Vladd67]

Talking of diluting the brand.
https://io9.gizmodo.com/cbs-all-access-is-laying-the-groundwork-for-non-stop-st-1828131470

 

[Vince W]

How would a normal ST space ship do against Imperial warships? I know they have a lot more speed and warp capability but I fear that ST would lose big time. Orcs methods would certainly make StarFleet officers to change their underwear. Out of everything I think Borgs would lose big time against the Tyranids.

[/offtopic]

[ot]Star Trek is tainted by Warp and would be hunted down by the Inquisition.[/ot]

 

[Hugh]

My guess is that the series will begin with Picard languishing in a Romulan dungeon, where he has been for the past five years having been framed as a leader in a failed coup by persons unknown.

 

[Overread]

How would a normal ST space ship do against Imperial warships? I know they have a lot more speed and warp capability but I fear that ST would lose big time. Orcs methods would certainly make StarFleet officers to change their underwear. Out of everything I think Borgs would lose big time against the Tyranids.

.

Star Trek is odd. Starwars and Warhammer 40K both have ships with WAY bigger sizes and covered in weapons from tip to engines. On a purely military might angle the Federation would lose and would lose totally without question. Heck one thing I did like and that did show this up in a big way was in the last film where you actually saw the first proper Warship in the Romulan Battleship. 3 Warp Cores powering a huge number of weapons. It's mega-weapon aside it was a proper battleship; whilst most others in the franchise have perhaps one or two weapons. Even the Borg are pretty lightly armed.

Thing is ST has several big trump cards. Teleporters. Used right they can teleport bombs, troops and other resources into enemy units or pull key parts out (I'm surprised we've never seen them lock into the shield generator and just teleport a chunk of it out so it breaks).
Then you've got the deflector dish and science whereby a few modifications here and there and suddenly a nebula is a huge bomb.

Then you've got Q and other aliens who are godlike in power and could sweep away whole armies with a finger (though I'd wager against 40K the Q wouldn't stand up much to the Chaos Gods).




Ahem but er back to new Trek!
I wouldn't mind a grumpy Picard, but I don't want a morose or depressed character. Both are super hard to achieve in the long run (a few episodes is fine or as a big changing element in the first season) without the people just hating them (although visual mediums are easier to work with than books - depressed chracters in books are very hard to pull off as leads)

 

[Brian G Turner]

I am continually vexed over the fact that those who are purportedly fans of Star Trek and Star Wars do nothing but put down/complain about everything produced in those particular universes.

We complain when fckwit studio execs keeping looking to milk cows instead of telling good stories.

This feature is a great example - Picard returns in a new Star Trek series, perhaps based at the academy, or playing the role of an ambassador?

Oh - look what I wrote here, back in 2004: Voyager to Enterprise - a mistake?

After "Voyager" I imagined a new show called "Ambassador" - a figure like Jean Luc Picard travelling a D-class Enterprise, whose mission was to help restore order and confidence in the Trek universe, especially after all the DS9 upset. Basically, I was thinking that the Trek producers would try and pull everything back into a more settled state, bring the franchise under a sense of completion, and reach a point of moving on into new territory based on favourite old concepts.

But what did they do instead? Create a complete new and unreferenced history, effectively destroying the credibility of a Star Trek time line and any sense of continuity, gave the show a soft rock anthem, and has effectively left the entire Trek Universe in an extended state of incompletion.

And then what did they do? Create a new set of films with a completely different timeline and no real continuity with the very franchise they were working with!!

But, finally, they might be getting their act together? If so, why so long?

Btw, for the record, I *do* like the new Star Trek films - but it's clearly an example of milking a brand over want to tell great and original new stories within the same franchise universe.


Similar criticism applies to Star Wars, but less so - after four decades of expanded universe fiction, the best story they can come up with for the new trilogy is ... a tribute to the original trilogy?

And a standalone film about the "plot hole" relating to the weakness of the Death Star that was not a plot hole?

Or dedicate a new film about Han Solo, then cast the very first actor who auditions - even though he doesn't look like Harrison Ford?


There's good stuff coming out of both franchises, but it's tainted by the stupidity of studios - who demand our money and loyalty, but make a limited effort to earn either.

That's why we complain.

 

[thaddeus6th]

Pretty much agree with Brian.

Although Seven of Nine in a catsuit was obviously not a mistake.

 

[dwndrgn]

Star Trek is odd. Starwars and Warhammer 40K both have ships with WAY bigger sizes and covered in weapons from tip to engines. On a purely military might angle the Federation would lose and would lose totally without question. Heck one thing I did like and that did show this up in a big way was in the last film where you actually saw the first proper Warship in the Romulan Battleship. 3 Warp Cores powering a huge number of weapons. It's mega-weapon aside it was a proper battleship; whilst most others in the franchise have perhaps one or two weapons. Even the Borg are pretty lightly armed.

Thing is ST has several big trump cards. Teleporters. Used right they can teleport bombs, troops and other resources into enemy units or pull key parts out (I'm surprised we've never seen them lock into the shield generator and just teleport a chunk of it out so it breaks).
Then you've got the deflector dish and science whereby a few modifications here and there and suddenly a nebula is a huge bomb.

Then you've got Q and other aliens who are godlike in power and could sweep away whole armies with a finger (though I'd wager against 40K the Q wouldn't stand up much to the Chaos Gods).

Star Trek, unlike Warhammer and others franchises of similar ilk wasn't created as a showpiece for war, warships and 'my gun is bigger than yours' competitions. Enterprise isn't a war ship at all and was never designed as such. It is a ship for exploration and thus its weapons are not its purpose and are only there for defense.

Regarding what Brian says about how studios handle the franchises - I agree up to a point. Studios aren't in it to please the fans, they want what will make the most money. Now, logical thinking would make you now say "but if the fans are happy they'll purchase movie tickets etc." and this is definitely true, in short term. In the long term, they want to gain more fans. So they take something that has a fan base already, create something related to that that is designed to appeal to a much larger audience than just the original fan base, which includes younger fans - people who don't know all the ins and outs of the franchises canon. So their stories are much more diffused. It is like taking a lovely bottle of wine that four people are enjoying and saying, 'how can I make more money off of this single bottle?' well, add it to a barrel and toss in some sugar, maybe some fruit juice...and you have sangria which will appeal to many more people than just the original four and will earn a heck of a lot more money (well, unless the bottle was Opus 1 to begin with). And now I'm just rambling.

And let me add, I enjoyed Star Trek Voyager. As a fan who does not count dates, keep track of timelines and who just enjoys the story, I found nothing wrong with it outside of a few really silly plot points. That being said, I still have not seen Solo. Han is my favorite character and I'm very nervous to see the (really not well cast) new version.