Babylon 5 vs Star Trek

[Parson]

Dallas had no planned arc and no real end in sight. Soap Operas just keep going until the money dries up. The same went for Hill Street Blues, though it was far more sophisticated than soap as I recall.

As for Flash Gordon etc, they are shorts that, as a story, congeal together to make a roughly hour long self-contained tale.

A lot of it, of course, is that B5 (and all the shows like it) could only exist in an era of video and dvd sales. In fact, shows have become more complex and arc-driven in response to that technology.

The only show of the above mentioned I watched regularly was Hill Street Blues. My sense is that the story arc would have been season long, but that they were quite okay to refer, tangentially perhaps, about other things that had happened in other seasons.

I had noticed the increased complexity in television series but it didn't dawn on me that it could be related to dvds and other retrieval mechanisms.

 

[J-WO]

Makes one wonder how complex plots will get when we can download shows in to our minds!

 

[Parson]

Ouch! I can't bear to think of having Survivor, or Dancing with the Stars, Barney down loaded. It sounds like cruel and unusual punishment to me.

 

[JunkMonkey]

But seriously, what the heck is wrong with us SF fans? There's a fact we should be shouting from the rooftops but for some reason never do, and its simply this- Bab 5 invented the story arc! Hour long shows were, for all intents and purposes, self contained before Strazcinski came along and worked his magic. Voiceovers saying 'Previously on...' only occured at the start of the second episode oftwo parters.

In American TV maybe but I seem to recall reading interviews with JMS when he enthused over British shows like Doctor Who and, particularly, Blake's Seven which allowed for long, week to week, story development.

 

[JunkMonkey]

I presume everyone on this thread is familiar with Star Wreck: In the Perkinning which answers many of the "What if?" questions implied in this thread's title

Star Wreck: In the Pirkinning - Download the movie :: Streaming video or BitTorrent download

 

[Brian G Turner]

Yes, but better enjoyed the original version, before they had to change the ships for copyright purposes.

 

[Daisy-Boo]

All this talk of B5 makes me want to watch it over again.

Me too.

I just checked on my favourite online store and all the DVDs are very reasonably priced. I'm going to add a couple to my trolley every month until I've collected all.

 

[alfaholic]

OK, this is an old thread, but I have a few questions...
First of all, sorry because of my broken English...

I am Star Trek fan, mostly because of idea of the future, and that positive view of everything that comes.
Another thing is the absence of religion and money, I like that "Zeitgeist" way of thinking, something like Nikola Tesla talk about a hundred years ago...

I like The Next Generation because I was just 8, or 9 years old, and I remember, I was waiting midnight to watch that great beginning with:"Captain's log...", great music, and scientific approach in the storyline.

Then the similar thing with the Voyager, and after all, disappointment with Deep Space Nine. DS9 was sooo boring, I could not watch more than 15, or 16 episodes. So static, stories are full with religion, money, and all those shallow thematics I do not like. It is not representing future, it is the same as our present.

Then, the most interesting thing in Star Trek is thematics with scientific problems, for example two Enterprise ships at the same time, then time travel, strange physics, and things like that.

Before I ask the question, I would like to apologize because of my English, and then if I do not understand SF very well, but that is just my opinion, and my taste.

I never watched Babylon 5, I am now preparing to start watching, I do not like complex human drama in this kind of TV shows, I like Star Trek because of scientific approach, and stories related to the space and science, so my biggest question is:
Am I going to like Babylon 5?

 

[Parson]

Alfaholic You sound a bit like me, and the answer would be that you will not like Babylon 5 as much as you did Star Trek." But I have to warn you this is a minority opinion around here. Babylon 5 has a much darker view of the future, and far, far less scientific tangles. It is most certainly the human drama which makes it go, rather than the science and the sense of discovery. On the other hand Babylon 5 has much truer to life characters, they grow, change, develop, and become either more or less important and likable as the show goes on. You should watch it because you will be amazed to see where it goes and how it works out.

 

[Whitestar]

OK, this is an old thread, but I have a few questions...
First of all, sorry because of my broken English...

I am Star Trek fan, mostly because of idea of the future, and that positive view of everything that comes.
Another thing is the absence of religion and money, I like that "Zeitgeist" way of thinking, something like Nikola Tesla talk about a hundred years ago...

I like The Next Generation because I was just 8, or 9 years old, and I remember, I was waiting midnight to watch that great beginning with:"Captain's log...", great music, and scientific approach in the storyline.

Then the similar thing with the Voyager, and after all, disappointment with Deep Space Nine. DS9 was sooo boring, I could not watch more than 15, or 16 episodes. So static, stories are full with religion, money, and all those shallow thematics I do not like. It is not representing future, it is the same as our present.

Then, the most interesting thing in Star Trek is thematics with scientific problems, for example two Enterprise ships at the same time, then time travel, strange physics, and things like that.

Before I ask the question, I would like to apologize because of my English, and then if I do not understand SF very well, but that is just my opinion, and my taste.

I never watched Babylon 5, I am now preparing to start watching, I do not like complex human drama in this kind of TV shows, I like Star Trek because of scientific approach, and stories related to the space and science, so my biggest question is:
Am I going to like Babylon 5?

For the record, DS9 is the best Star Trek show to date because it featured three dimensional characters with flaws, quirks, and perks. It was great because it showed the good and bad parts of human beings where all viewpoints other than the Federation's are represented, thus, creating a much more enrich universe.

Now, if you thought DS9 was boring, then you won't like Babylon 5 because it focuses on realistic characters just like on DS9. Also, like it or not, themes such as religion and money will always be a part of our culture and will continue to do so in the future. In short, if you don't like to watch a sci-fi show that has developed and relatable characters and instead prefer cookie-cutter black-and-white caricatures like that of TOS and especially TNG who are always right and can do no wrong with no other viewpoints represented, then don't watch Babylon 5.

On the other hand, if you keep an open mind, then by all means see it. However, I have to warn you in advance that the first season is very painful to watch because the actor who plays the protagonist Commander Jeffrey Sinclair is awful and there are some very cheesy moments throughout the first season in general, but it gets better towards the end in which the last several episodes leading to the first season finale is well worth it. Season two is a vast improvement and by seasons three and four the show really hits it's stride, it's quite a roller coaster ride. So, if you are ready for something different and be challenged, then you must see Babylon 5, the choice is yours.

 

[Dave]

For the record, DS9 is the best Star Trek show to date because it featured three dimensional characters with flaws, quirks, and perks. It was great because it showed the good and bad parts of human beings where all viewpoints other than the Federation's are represented, thus, creating a much more enrich universe.

I personally totally agree, but each to their own. My wife (not an SF fan) once watched DS9 and told me it was just a "soap opera in fancy dress". I can see that point of view.

I like The Next Generation because [of the] ...scientific approach in the storyline.

There was a lot more "science" in the science fiction of TNG. I'd say it was even educational as it did help explain difficult to understand science concepts to the masses.

Am I going to like Babylon 5?

I'd have to agree with Whitestar and Parson and say 'No' there.

 

[alfaholic]

Thank you all...

I will watch it, that is for sure, then I will let you know did I like it, or did I change my point of view.


I asked because I tried to watch Andromeda, but after one season I stoped, for me the best part were the quotes at the beginning of each episode.
Maybe I am wrong again, but that is just my feel...

 

[Whitestar]

For the record, DS9 is the best Star Trek show to date because it featured three dimensional characters with flaws, quirks, and perks. It was great because it showed the good and bad parts of human beings where all viewpoints other than the Federation's are represented, thus, creating a much more enrich universe.

I personally totally agree, but each to their own. My wife (not an SF fan) once watched DS9 and told me it was just a "soap opera in fancy dress". I can see that point of view.

Yes, I suppose interpersonal relationships and soap opera go hand-in-hand, eh?

There was a lot more "science" in the science fiction of TNG. I'd say it was even educational as it did help explain difficult to understand science concepts to the masses.

Yes, TNG was somewhat educational in physics, but for the most part, it consisted of Star Trek physics.

Am I going to like Babylon 5?

I'd have to agree with Whitestar and Parson and say 'No' there.

Not unless Alfaholic gives it a chance.

Thank you all...

I will watch it, that is for sure, then I will let you know did I like it, or did I change my point of view.


I asked because I tried to watch Andromeda, but after one season I stoped, for me the best part were the quotes at the beginning of each episode.
Maybe I am wrong again, but that is just my feel...

Andromeda was excellent in it's own right because the stories in seasons one and two were great, as well as staying true to the laws of physics (barring the quantum slipstream drive concept). In addition, it's depiction of space combat was realistic in which starship enemy vessels engaged each other well outside visual range. But the show got dumbed down for the least common denominator because Sorbo wanted to please his Hercules fans and he is solely to blame for that.

 

[Rodders]

I enjoyed both although Babylon 5 was (and is) my favourite. (Personally, i though B5 was the greatest thing that i've ever seen.)

 

[Interference]

You will find things in B5 to like and enjoy (the jump gates, the almost well-reasoned idea of sub/hyper-space, believable alienness of the aliens)but it is essentially a series about mythology, legend and religion (of a sort) which evidently inspired the creator of the series.

I am sad to say you will not be likely to become B5's biggest fan, but there are good relationships between characters and a lot of hardware to admire

(for some time, B5 and DS9 were in competition and, while subtle references to it is made in B5 - notably the B5 dolls - DS9 seemed to just go out and steal a few ideas)

 

[Ursa major]

You won't know until you try it, alfaholic. In spite of your doubts, there might just be something that draws you into the show; or repels you.

Anyway, I hope you enjoy it.

 

[Dave]

Yes, TNG was somewhat educational in physics, but for the most part, it consisted of Star Trek physics.

That is a very fair point, however, for the most point it had good science advisors (Lawrence Krauss' book on The Science of Star Trek critiques a lot of it and he was an advisor.) It also had people such as Stephen Hawking as fans - he even appeared in it! And I think life imitates art; some of the technology we aspire to even if we can't quite have it yet - TOS communicators, PADDs, LCARS.

 

[alfaholic]

Thank you all...

I do not want to look like some shallow guy who wants to see only special effects, or that kind of mumbo-jumbo, no...
Just, I like SF because it represents some way where the science can lead us, I think it is important more than religion, people relations, personal problems of the crew, or any other problem people have now in the present, and here on Earth.

I like a good plot, and good acting, directing, but my view of SF is science at the first place, or science of the show's universe, then everything else of course.
Otherwise I can watch some good drama, and I will be happy with plot, and everything else, it doesn't need to be placed in the future, or in the space.
The Bridges Of Madison County can do that.

Please, do not get me wrong, I just want to explain my views, and why I am asking these questions.
I will certainly watch Babylon 5, then I will let you know my subjective opinion about it.

 

[Rodders]

I'm looking forward to seeing what you think. (I need to contact my friend to see if he can bring mine back too. I'm going to start watching them next week.)

 

[JunkMonkey]

One thing I don't think anyone has mentioned in this thread so far is that B5 is genuinely funny at times. A feat Star Trek struggled with from time to time but never really made work - partially I think because the comedy elements were often very obviously and self-conciously bolted on (oh those hilarious Ferengi) rather than coming out of the characters. Ivanova having 'sex' in one episode, and Delenn's incomprehension of Mr Garibaldi's 'second favourite thing in the Universe' (and popcorn) being two that come to mind.

And I've always loved this little exchange that takes place during a drunken orgy:

Vir Cotto:
Ahh, he has become one
with his inner self.

Michael Garibaldi:
He's passed out!

Vir Cotto:
That too.​