The Revived Tolkien Trivia

[farntfar]

You're right Grimward, about the first two.
Look 2 pages further on and see
Then Curufin looked darkly upon Eöl. 'Do not flaunt the title of your wife before me,' he said. 'For those who steal the daughters of the Noldor and wed them without gift or leave do not gain kinship with their kin. .....

But the last one isn't Aragorn.

All the stuff about Merry was to point out that it was all about the meaning of their name, as you judged. And that their name would appear to have something to do with a tree but doesn't.
Also they are a much closer relation to Aredhel than Aragorn.
So stay in the same book as the first bit, but look toward the back!

 

[Corbier]

The shiny one is then Míriel the Jewel-daughter? From The Silmarillion index "mir" jewel?

 

[farntfar]

I'm afraid not, Cor.
A good try, but what about the tree question?

 

[Corbier]

Well... whenever did she refer to a tree then?

 

[farntfar]

Sorry.
I've made myself misunderstood again.
I mean it's not Miriél. It's someone else.

I meant it was a good try, because you were looking in the right sort of place.Just shift you're eyes to the left.

 

[Grimward]

Argh. This tree thing is gonna kill me. I can make both ties and cases for Feanor (Spirit of Fire) and Ar-Pharazon (the Golden), but neither name has ANYTHING to do with trees, nor is there any passage where either makes "no reference" to a tree to anyone's surprise. And Feanor IS to the left of Miriel, but it's the original Miriel, and NOT the wife of Ar-Pharazon. And Appendix F is no help.

 

[farntfar]

OK, Grim.
So I've mis-lead you, because I must have misunderstood where Cor was refering to.

I had assumed that he was looking in the appendix, not the index, to find mir means jewel.
Find that and look to the left and up a bit.
If you still can't find it, I'll give up too.

 

[Grimward]

Wow. I sat there trying to break down Feanor and Pharazon (of course, there's no 'z' to begin with, which made that an entirely futile pursuit), but looked for Miriel whole under the persons section, idiot that I am.

Typing it out for my penance.

Kal -(gal) This root, meaning 'shine', appears in Calacirya, Calaquendi, Tar-calion; galvorn, Gil-galad, Galadriel. The last two names have no connexion with Sindarin galadh 'tree', although in the case of Galadriel such a connexion was often made, and the name altered to Galadhriel. In the High-elven speech her name was Al(a)tariel, derived from alata 'radiance' (Sindarin galad) and riel 'garlanded maiden'...

Galadriel, of course, is the cousin of Aredhel.

The Silmarillion, Appendix, Elements in Quenya and Sindarin Names


Ceding this one to Corbier, who was spot on and one page away from the final part, to put any finishing touches on the answer where the surprise element is concerned, and to take the bell. Well-played, well-hidden, and entirely masterful challenge, far.

 

[Pyan]

Well-played, well-hidden, and entirely masterful challenge, far.

I agree, absolutely. I've been sitting watching this one twist and turn, and I must say, it's been fascinating. Well played, poser and solvers alike.

Hopefully, I'll be back shortly (I must plead extenuating, out-of-my-hands reasons for not having the time of late) and look forward to the next round...

 

[farntfar]

Well done Grim.

I think I probably should have made it into 2 questions.
Would you believe that I thought asking the 1st part would make the second part easier? No? well never mind.
I've always loved the creation of names and words bit, and remember the Galadriel derivation from my first reading of the Silmarillion some several decades ago. Also the brown twist in brandybuck/brandywine (described in a similar appendix in the LOTR if you didn't find it), which I can't use as a follow-up question now. (Rats!)

Not sure you should cede the bell, since it was you who finally got all three names, but I'm not going to argue about it.
So I offer you a shiney thing, almost but not quite entirely unlike a tree.

 

[Corbier]

Ceding this one to Corbier, who was spot on and one page away from the final part, to put any finishing touches on the answer where the surprise element is concerned, and to take the bell. Well-played, well-hidden, and entirely masterful challenge, far.

Nope. I wouldn't dare take the floor seeing how you gave three out of three correct answers while I gave zero out of three correct answers. Floor is yours, mate.

I have to say that this one was really challenging. We want more, Far!

 

[farntfar]

Thanks guys for finding it interesting. I was afraid you'd find it too fussy.
Not sure I can find anything similar though, Cor.

So who's going next then?

 

[Grimward]

Well, all right (but I still think you should take it, Corb; I'd still be blinded and beating the air like Tulkas without your clue!), and thanks again for a merry chase.

*Eyes ring that's not quite entirely unlike a tree, contemplates, and then...*

Blurred eyes and crannied brows look towards this place.

 

[Pyan]

Well, these are the Argonath, the Pillars of the Kings. So the answer must be The North...

Upon great pedestals founded in the deep waters stood two great kings of stone: still with blurred eyes and crannied brows they frowned upon the North. The left hand of each was raised palm outwards in gesture of warning; in each right hand there was an axe; upon each head there was a crumbling helm and crown. Great power and majesty they still wore, the silent wardens of a long-vanished kingdom.

FotR, Book 2, Ch.9, The Great River

BTW, here's yet another example of Mr Jackson's gratuitous and unfathomable alterations - for some reason, the Argonath in the film are carrying swords, not axes....

 

[hopewrites]

I assumed he changed their weapons because each race seems bound to one kind of wrapon. Ie; dwarves may only have axes, men (and the more man-like creatures) may have swords, preferably lon, elves may have bows and any length of blade, hobbits ought to be restricted to cast iron cookery and slings, but Sam is the only hobbitish hobbit at the start...
I felt sad over the dumbing down initially, then decided it wasnt really worth my emotional energy to regret that mainstreaming of an excellent work required it to be brought down to mainstream levels.

 

[Grimward]

You're on the right path, and looking at the right cardinal point more or less, Your Greenness sir, but I require a more specific answer.

 

[Corbier]

Did you want the green Gentleman to tell you "the North" in the quote is Arnor perhaps?

Then Elendil the Tall and his mighty sons, Isildur and Anárion, became great lords; and the North-realm they made in Arnor, and the South-realm in Gondor[.]

The Lord of the Rings, The Fellowship of the Ring, ch. 2 "The Council of Elrond"

 

[Pyan]

I thought of that - but the Argonath were a warning, and Gondor would hardly need to warn against Arnor. If a specific threat existed, they were more likely to be a warning against Angmar.

c.1300 (TA)...The Nazgûl reappear. The chief of those comes north to Angmar....

RotK, Appendix B, The Tale of Years

The Argonath were built in c.1300 TA.

On his return, Romendecil fortified the west shore of Anduin... It was he who built the pillars of the Argonath at the entrance to Nen Hithoel

RotK, Appendix A (iv), Gondor and the heirs of Anárion

 

[Grimward]

Hmm, if one were to compare this challenge to the previous gem offered by far, one might say that it lacked depth...

 

[Pyan]

Umm - this could be a clue...

Sarn Gebir, the Rapids, where Anduin flows into the northern part of the Emyn Muil?

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