Foundation & Empire

[chornedsnorkack]

Also, why was the effect of Shield this:

In the sudden, frozen silence, Bayta found the cubicle once again empty. The nuclear glow of the walls was dead, the soft current of conditioned air absent.

Somewhere the sound of a shrill siren was rising and falling in the scale and Randu formed the words with his lips, "Space raid!"

And Ebling Mis held his wrist watch to his ears and shouted suddenly, "Stopped, by the "Ga-LAX-y, is there a watch in the room that is going?" His voice was a roar.

Twenty wrists went to twenty ears. And in far less than twenty seconds, it was quite certain that none were.

"Then," said Mis, with a grim and horrible finality, "something has stopped all nuclear power in the Time Vault - and the Mule is attacking."

If watches - ALL 20 watches - were stopped, then why was an air raid siren working?

 

[Bick]

Because a siren would of course be powered by a UPS of some sort, same as today.

 

[chornedsnorkack]

Because a siren would of course be powered by a UPS of some sort, same as today.

UPS of which sort?
Look at the Foundation technology, already 150 year older:

The Siwennian ignored him and proceeded without deflection. "During his exile a wanderer came upon him; a merchant from the edge of the Galaxy; a young man who spoke a strange accent, knew nothing of recent Imperial history, and who was protected by an individual force-shield."
"An individual force-shield?" Riose glared. "You speak extravagance. What generator could be powerful enough to condense a shield to the size of a single man? By the Great Galaxy, did he carry five thousand myria-tons of nuclear power-source about with him on a little wheeled gocart?"

Barr said quietly, "This is the magician of whom you hear whispers, stories and myths. The name 'magician' is not lightly earned. He carried no generator large enough to be seen, but not the heaviest weapon you can carry in your hand would have as much as creased the shield he bore."

"Is this all the story there is? Are the magicians born of maunderings of an old man broken by suffering and exile?"

"The story of the magicians antedated even my father, sir. And the proof is more concrete. After leaving my father, this merchant that men call a magician visited a Tech-man at the city to which my father had guided him, and there he left a shield-generator of the type he wore. That generator was retrieved by my father after his return from exile upon the execution of the bloody viceroy. It took a long time to find-

"The generator hangs on the wall behind you, sir. It does not work. It never worked but for the first two days; but if you'll look at it, you will see that no one in the Empire ever designed it."

Bel Riose reached for the belt of linked metal that clung to the curved wall. It came away with a little sucking noise as the tiny adhesion-field broke at the touch of his hand. The ellipsoid at the apex of the belt held his attention. It was the size of a walnut.

"This-" he said.

"Was the generator," nodded Barr. "But it was the generator. The secret of its workings are beyond discovery now. Sub-electronic investigations have shown it to be fused into a single lump of metal and not all the most careful study of the diffraction patterns have sufficed to distinguish the discrete parts that had existed before fusion."

150 years before, a nuclear power source the size of a walnut was usable and was used as the power source for mass production individual shields.
During Mule´s attack, nuclear power sources were so convenient, cheap and reliable that 20 out of 20 wristwatches in the Vault were powered by nuclear power reactors - and stopped by Mule´s Shield.
If that was the case, wouldn´t the path of least resistance have been to use nuclear power sources as the UPS´es of air raid sirens - which would then have been shut down by Mule´s antinuclear shield?

 

[Bick]

Battery powered? I wouldn't worry about it too much

 

[chornedsnorkack]

Why, then, were no wristwatches battery powered?

 

[chornedsnorkack]

Next absurdity: the conclusion of fall of Terminus:

The proclamation of occupation was made twenty-four hours to the minute after Seldon had appeared before the former mighty of the Foundation.

Of all the Foundation planets, only the Independent Traders still stood, and against them the power of the Mule - conqueror of the Foundation - now turned itself.

Um?
We are told:

Excellence, not a vehicle is running in the city, not a communication line to the outside is open.
The Tenth Fleet is reported defeated and the Mule's ships are outside the atmosphere. The general staff-

It was Tenth Fleet that was defeated. Meaning that Fleets First to Ninth were not present at Terminus, therefore not defeated.
The description of Foundation's mood in the morning did not imply that Terminus was the lone remaining planet under siege. Not even besieged by an overwhelming force like Bel Riose - the defeats looked like a string of bad luck or treasons, Foundation had lost battles, fleets and territory, but still held large territories and large navies scattered to protect them.
Meaning that when the capital fell to a surprise decapitation attack, the bulk of Foundation forces and possessions must have been elsewhere.

Independent Traders were 27 planets, with a total of about a couple of millions of souls. Anacreon alone was 32 planets, with over 20 000 millions of souls.
How did the remaining Foundation navies and possessions act after the fall of Terminus?

 

[chornedsnorkack]

Back to Dead Hand - points I haven´t mentioned...

Giant ships passed the vast distances that separated the vagrant stars at the Galaxy's rim, and felt their way around the outermost edge of Foundation influence.

Worlds isolated in their new barbarism of two centuries felt the sensation once again of Imperial overlords upon their soil. Allegiance was sworn in the face of the massive artillery covering capital cities.

Garrisons were left; garrisons of men in Imperial uniform with the Spaceship-and-Sun insignia upon their shoulders. The old men took notice and remembered once again the forgotten tales of their grandfathers' fathers of the times when the universe was big, and rich, and peaceful and that same Spaceship-and-Sun ruled all.

Then the great ships passed on to weave their line of forward bases further around the Foundation.

Fine, but the small detail:

No opposition has appeared anywhere. The barbarians are quiet. And particularly, no opposition has come from Foundation forces. They sleep peacefully and well.

Absence of opposition is logical - the barbarians don´t hope to resist. "Quietness" - not quite.
In face of giant ships approaching... We see that in Big and Small and Wedge, the barbarians still have space travel. States span several star systems. They trade with their neighbours, and receive FTL communications.
In face of known approaching giant ships, sleeping peacefully till massive artillery covers your capital is not the most obvious choice to make. Alternatives include scraping together some ships, treasure and supporters and fleeing. Or else actively offering cooperation and allegiance to the approaching forces in hope of getting better terms, by sending ships with envoys to meet the giant ships before they reach your capital, or contact them by ultrawave.
Doing nothing is not a completely improbable course to take. It´s not odd that Foundation did so, instead of committing to another course of action. But it is odd that all the independent states of Periphery should do the same.
Also, there was a part of Foundation that had to do something. The Foundation traders who were present at the Periphery states in the course of ordinary visits.

 

[chornedsnorkack]

Another absurdity:

The Mule defeated the navies of the Foundation at will, but he has not once managed to force the much weaker fleets of the Independent Traders to retreat in open combat.

If that was the case, why were the Merchants losing?

 

[dekket]

Because while the Traders fleet did not retreat, there ships were still being destroyed.

 

[Bick]

If you find so much to be critical of chornedsnorkack, why do you read it?

 

[Ihe]

I have briefly entertained the idea that chornedsnorkack is actually Asimov's ghost come back to troll us.

 

[chornedsnorkack]

Foundation is a classic. Exciting story. Hinting at a setting. That´s the original Galactic Empire.
The problem is that when I try to fill in the gaps, the gaping plot holes become apparent.

The Merchants, despite the setting details that should have made them negligible, act as if they could withstand Foundation - and Seldon confirms that they could have forced Foundation to compromise.
If the Merchants had technical superiority that allowed them to defeat Mule in face of Mule´s numerical superiority, they should have used it to attack Mule´s advancing navies, rather than sit at home waiting for the Mule to cut their communications and besiege them separately.
In which case either they would have won (and would not have lost the war) or would have lost (in which case Mis would have said that Mule needed huge superiority to defeat Merchants in battle - he would have said that Merchants were defeated in battle).

And they had even better options.
Remember that it was Tenth Fleet that was defeated - Foundation had first nine Fleets that were not at Terminus.

Even if the admirals of Foundation lacked the initiative to rally Foundation fleets to fight on against Mule and retake Terminus, the Merchants might have, in the aftermath of fall of Terminus, challenged Foundation fleets to submit to Merchant commanders.
What would have happened?

 

[chornedsnorkack]

Now, look at the description of the final takeover of Terminus:
Terminus was left undisturbed for at least 18 hours after surrender. From chapter 18:

The next day, the ugly, battle-black ships of the Mule poured down upon the landing fields of the planet Terminus. The attacking general sped down the empty main street of Terminus City in a foreign-made ground car that ran where a whole city of atomic cars still stood useless.
The proclamation of occupation was made twenty-four hours to the minute after Seldon had appeared before the former mighty of the Foundation.