Towers of Midnight (CAUTION! Contains Spoilers!)

[murphy]

(snip)

I don't know if I missed something, but was there mention of there being someone close to Perrin who was ready to act against him - and did I miss the revelation or is it still to come?

(snip)

Wasn't it the ex-tinker who turned against him when Perrin was rescuing Faile?

 

[Perpetual Man]

Wasn't it the ex-tinker who turned against him when Perrin was rescuing Faile?

Possibly, but I'm pretty sure in ToM after Perrin destroys the Dreamspike, overcomes Slayer, unites with Galad and defeats the Trolloc army there is mention made of someone close to him, so close that he would never suspect it, would soon make their move.

 

[Moggle]

I found this last book very much a waste of time; I could swear Brandon Sanderson was literally channeling Robert Jordan while he was writing it. Virtually nothing of any significance happened for the entire book! I was expecting an action packed rollercoaster leading into the last book, but instead I got the brooding memoirs of Perrin Aybarra.

Anyway, just 11 months to wait now

You mean 11 more months till Tarmon Gaidon!

 

[Kierkegaurdian]

I really liked both TGS and ToM. I think that TGS was a bit more ... polished. There were a lot of typos in ToM, and weird parts that probably would have been caught with more editing (Perrin already knew about the cleansing before Grady "revealed" it to him in ToM, for example, and this seems like a minor oversight on Sanderson's part). But overall, I think that the book was good, and that TGS and ToM are making for a great two thirds of the final arc of one of my favorite series.

 

[X'Nedra]

Possibly, but I'm pretty sure in ToM after Perrin destroys the Dreamspike, overcomes Slayer, unites with Galad and defeats the Trolloc army there is mention made of someone close to him, so close that he would never suspect it, would soon make their move.

Yes, I just finished the book yesterday, and one of the Forsaken (I can't remember which - they get all confused in my memory!) does mention this, but I think it is before he unites with Galad (while the trap has been set), before we get into the story with Slayer - I assumed Slayer was the one meant here, but I must admit I am a little confused over who Slayer is - is it Luc?
Now I am thinking perhaps it will be Elyas who the Forsaken was talking about? I guess we'll have to wait for the next book to find out!


I wonder which body part Perrin is going to lose since Rand lost his hand, and Mat lost his eye...?

 

[Kierkegaurdian]

Yes, I just finished the book yesterday, and one of the Forsaken (I can't remember which - they get all confused in my memory!) does mention this, but I think it is before he unites with Galad (while the trap has been set), before we get into the story with Slayer - I assumed Slayer was the one meant here, but I must admit I am a little confused over who Slayer is - is it Luc?
Now I am thinking perhaps it will be Elyas who the Forsaken was talking about? I guess we'll have to wait for the next book to find out!


I wonder which body part Perrin is going to lose since Rand lost his hand, and Mat lost his eye...?

Slayer = Luc = Isam ... the "man with two souls" that Moridin references in the conversation with Graendal where he gives her the dreamspike.

Well, Mat lost an eye mirroring Odin in Norse mythology, and Rand lost a hand mirroring Tyr, also in Norse mythology I believe. Perrin is a Thor-like character (M------- hammer and everything) and to the best of my knowledge Thor doesn't lose any body parts.

 

[C Of K]

I found this last book very much a waste of time; I could swear Brandon Sanderson was literally channeling Robert Jordan while he was writing it. Virtually nothing of any significance happened for the entire book! I was expecting an action packed rollercoaster leading into the last book, but instead I got the brooding memoirs of Perrin Aybarra.

I think I understand what you're saying. Perrin did spend a lot of time brooding, arguing with dead wolves, and practicing in his sleep. Some of that could have been cut. There have been so many previous books, that some of Perrin's wolf issues should have been long resolved by now.

I can't agree that Sanderson was channeling Jordan. It's not his fault that Jordan was dragging his feet in the character development areas. Rand did take his first steps into Tar Valon, and fulfilled Elaida's foretelling by facing the Amyrlin Seat. Sanderson actually used Lan for more than lounging around his wife, waiting to attack threats that never come. He also demonstrated why the most vaunted "Five Captains" are even worth having around, with Rodel Ituralde's defense against the Trollock horde.

The way the book ended, with Egwene unknowingly gathering the armies of the world to face Tarmon Gaidon was rather powerful as well. I personally suspected Towers of Midnight to be mostly build-up, knowing as I did that there would be one book left afterward. A Memory of Light is sure to be a barn burner.

 

[X'Nedra]

Slayer = Luc = Isam ... the "man with two souls" that Moridin references in the conversation with Graendal where he gives her the dreamspike.

Well, Mat lost an eye mirroring Odin in Norse mythology, and Rand lost a hand mirroring Tyr, also in Norse mythology I believe. Perrin is a Thor-like character (M------- hammer and everything) and to the best of my knowledge Thor doesn't lose any body parts.

Thank you so much! I might still have to do a full re-read before a lot of that stuff really sinks in!
Ooh, I didn't realise it was based in Nordic Mythology - coolness! Maybe Perrin is going to die, or lose Faile - it seems like he is due to sacrifice something (beside Hopper) since the other boys have. All speculation - I'm looking forward to next year to see how it all ends - it's going to have to be a massive book to tie everything up!

 

[Jake Reynolds]

I found this last book very much a waste of time; I could swear Brandon Sanderson was literally channeling Robert Jordan while he was writing it. Virtually nothing of any significance happened for the entire book! I was expecting an action packed rollercoaster leading into the last book, but instead I got the brooding memoirs of Perrin Aybarra.

Dude, really? Hmm, yeah, I spose nothing much happened, only Lan gathering the army of Malkier, Mat defeating the Gholam, The fall of Mesaana (and from the looks of it Graendal as well), Elaida showing the Seanchan gateways, the defeat of Slayer, Moiraine's rescue and Mat's resolution with Ael/Elfinn, Perrin's resolution with the Whitecloaks and his wolf self, open dissent in the Black Tower, Egwene bonding Gawyn after he saved her life from Seanchan assassins in a great fight scene, all pretty slow and boring really.

Brandon Sanderson has made Wheel of Time enjoyable again.

 

[Heck Tate]

I'm with Dubrech on this one, I don't understand how anyone can claim nothing happened in this book. I look forward to Memories of Light, but I don't think Perrin will lose a body part as is being discussed here, if such a thing was prophesied I must not have been paying attention when it happened. My prediction for Tarmon Gaidan has Rand and Perrin dying at Shayol Ghul after sealing up the Dark One's prison. Min had a vision in Towers in which she looked at Rand and saw two bodies at Shayol with blood on the rocks, so this is my guess of what that's supposed to mean. I think some part of the operation will require Perrin's blacksmithing skills to construct some sort of cage for the Dark One while Rand channels furiously beside him.

 

[Jake Reynolds]

Oh yeah, I almost forgot- the demise of most of the black ajah. Just a minor thing I know, but thought I'd mention it .

Good point Heck Tate- I wonder if there is a site somewhere that has acatlogued all of Min's viewings? I'd say someone on Dragonmoutn must have. Either way though, with balefire all bets are off.

 

[Perpetual Man]

But apart from Lan gathering the army of Malkier, Mat defeating the Gholam, The fall of Mesaana (and from the looks of it Graendal as well), Elaida showing the Seanchan gateways, the defeat of Slayer, Moiraine's rescue and Mat's resolution with Ael/Elfinn, Perrin's resolution with the Whitecloaks and his wolf self, open dissent in the Black Tower, Egwene bonding Gawyn after he saved her life from Seanchan assassins in a great fight scene annnnndddd the demise of most of the black ajah what actually happened in the Towers of Midnight (Done in the tone of what have the Romans ever given us?)

 

[Talysia]

Good point Heck Tate- I wonder if there is a site somewhere that has acatlogued all of Min's viewings? I'd say someone on Dragonmoutn must have. Either way though, with balefire all bets are off.

I'm not sure about Dragonmount, but I know there's a list of Min's viewings on the encyclopedia WoT: http://encyclopaedia-wot.org/ It's a bit hard to find, though - after you click on 'Index', you need to click on 'Prophecies'. Hope that helps.

 

[Jake Reynolds]

Cool, just had a look.




Maybe spoilers, not really.





From Eye of the World:
A red eagle, an eye on a balance scale, a dagger with a ruby, a horn, and a laughing face.

Holy hell, that's some outling and a half.

 

[Heck Tate]

Dubrech those are all Mat viewings, and all just general stuff. Red eagle of Manetheran, the eye on the scale is of course "half the light of the world," the dagger is the one from Shadar Logath, the horn is obviously the Horn of Valere which I had completely forgotten about until now.

Now that I've remembered it, I'm interested to see Mat's role in the Last Battle. Obviously he is the horn blower and that's going to have to pop up again, but because of his memories, I'd like to see Mat with Bashre and Bryne strategically commanding massive armies against the shadow.

 

[C Of K]

I don't think Perrin will lose a body part as is being discussed here, if such a thing was prophesied I must not have been paying attention when it happened.

I'm with you here, Heck Tate. Perrin has already lost his whole family. For him to lose a body part would be kind of meaningless after that.

 

[Rothgar]

Found some info on the timeline confusion with Tam's character at the SF Site.

"Perrin's story had fallen so far behind the rest of the main cast that Sanderson was forced to spend an inordinate amount of time on him. But he had to keep the other characters moving forward at the same time. As Perrin's story was fairly isolated, most readers probably wouldn't have noticed it but for one glitch: the character Tam al'Thor.

Tam spends a good deal of the novel seemingly in two places at once, both with Perrin and Rand. It's not until halfway through the book, when Tam takes his leave of Perrin's camp -- and Perrin subsequently witnesses the climatic event of The Gathering Storm -- that readers can place him definitively within the larger story.

This may seem like splitting hairs, but it's distracting and a little misleading. Two Tams? Is one of them a darkfriend imposter? A Forsaken in disguise coming in under Rand's radar? Nope. The doubles are just the last lingering vestige of poor plot mechanics. "

 

[Talysia]

Thanks for that, Rothgar. It's good to get a little clarification on the timeline issue.

 

[Rothgar]

You're welcome. However, I did kind of like the idea of an evil Tam right under Perrin's nose.

 

[Senta23]

Just a quick question. Who are the 5 great captain's again? I know Gareth Bryne, Davram Bashere and Rodel Iturelde, but who are the other 2 again?


I'm still convinced that it's Galad that will die in Rand's place. I don't think any of the 3 boys will die.