The beginning of a novel. Need your opinion!

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I'm not an expert in these matters, so please correct me if I am wrong, but I think putting it as chapter one would just stand out as a prologue by a different name. IMO this would be worse as chapter 1 sets the scene for the whole book and readers would think that they're getting a contemporary story when they're not.

Does the reader need a whole chapter/prologue to know pre-apocalyptic conditions? I understand that you as the author needs to know this, I'm just curious if the reader does. Can't any relevant points be shown through the main story? Maybe have it as a short story that people can access if they want to but not necessarily as part of the book?

I get the impression that you're adamant about the prologue, and that is ofc your perogative, my advice would be for you to think hard about it though if it's not really that relevant to the main story. Just my tuppence worth though.
 
That's a good suggestion of Jo's; you can keep the foreword as a freebie to release separately.

I agree that having the start of the disaster and then the next chapter subtitled '<number> years later' (literally or otherwise) is generally not a good idea. I have used something that could be described as a prologue in one of my novels, but it happens immediately before the action of the main novel, and the reader eventually finds out what was going on, plus the character has been key throughout the novel. Not sure if Grace should be the focus in the prologue if she's not crucial to the story - that seems a double reason not to have that section in the novel.
 
Thanks for your opinion guys! I see the point and I have already considered removing the prologue (not once). I just strongly feel it reads better with it than without, starting from basically describing the end of the world. It's not about the world building, it's more like showing the problem happen and the rest of the book is dealing with it. Seen it done that way in Dean Koontz and Stephen King books, for example. Like some books begin with showing a murder happen, and in the second chapter we see the detective begin to solve it. Anyway, given the amount of critique I received here just on the first few pages, I'm currently reevaluating the whole thing, perhaps it has more important issues than having a prologue. Thanks for your help!
 
Jackie Bee said:
Anyway, given the amount of critique I received here just on the first few pages, I'm currently reevaluating the whole thing, perhaps it has more important issues than having a prologue. Thanks for your help!
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Nooooooooo don't do that! The intention wasn't to dishearten you to the point of giving up but I suppose it depends on how much you want to write and improve your skills. Your story = your rules, to a certain degree but we (apologies if I put the wrong words into others' mouths) are only trying to help you on the way to the publishing nirvana.

I know how soul destroying it can be when your baby is picked apart by people who just don't seem to get what you're trying to do but here (especially) are experts who have been where we are now and are merely directing us in the right direction, whether we chose that path or not is entirely up to us.

Do you go to writing classes/groups? Do you read many non-fiction works on the writing craft? How long have you been writing? They say it can take up to a million words before we're any good - I know I'm a long way off that yet.

I think you have a good concept and it could work but writing is hard work - harder than it looks! And it takes a thick skin to make it.
 
Alex Darion said:
Do you go to writing classes/groups? Do you read many non-fiction works on the writing craft? How long have you been writing? They say it can take up to a million words before we're any good - I know I'm a long way off that yet.
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Since I live in a non-English-speaking country, I could find no writing groups-sadly... but I read books on writing a lot, so I know the rules, it just takes a lot of practice to get them right. I've been writing for about 3 years. Not anywhere near a million words yet, probably around 150000 or something :)
Alex Darion said:
I think you have a good concept and it could work but writing is hard work - harder than it looks! And it takes a thick skin to make it.
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Thanks for the support , Alex :)
 
Jackie Bee said:
Since I live in a non-English-speaking country, I could find no writing groups-sadly... but I read books on writing a lot, so I know the rules, it just takes a lot of practice to get them right. I've been writing for about 3 years. Not anywhere near a million words yet, probably around 150000 or something :)
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So, start a virtual one? My writing group currently has someone from England, Australia and two from NI in it. The current group has never met and is unlikely to (an earlier formation of it did manage to be all in the same room at the same time once, though). It doesn't take away at all - we discuss, we share, we deliver cake. And there is nothing, nothing, nothing - not here, not reading, not a million books - to replace them.*

*My fearsome editor has indicated a key scene may be lacking in smack. I have a couple of weeks to add smack. So the first people I've turned to with my rewritten scene is my writing group and they'll get it there with me. Oh, yes, they will... And vice versa.
 
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Alex Darion said:
That's such a shame. Are there not any other English-writing writers in your area? There may be more than you realise. Maybe put a notice up in a local community centre/library - start a revolution ;)
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Maybe I will, I' considering it...it's only that if I start it I will be responsible for it and I have no experience with organizing such things. But this particular thread really made me think about it. I had two professional editors look at my first chapters, and yet they didn't notice the problems you guys did. It really shows that a writing group could be very usefull.
 
I actually like the way the plane crash happens and then is played down. I think that's more powerful in a way than a sort of standard disaster scene going straight into panic, flashing lights etc. Something bizarre and terrible happens - but then it's almost as if it didn't happen - leaving Grace and the reader wondering. Is it real or isn't it? And I like all the details about office life too and people getting on with things - sort of like the Titanic sinking but nobody realises yet. I also like that Grace feels disappointed that she isn't going to be first with the disaster news - that's very human. And humorous, in a way. I like the conjunction of plane crash and virus creating some mystery about how they are related. And it's definitely a great last line.

I think you should cut the opening dialogue though, or change it. The first line doesn't sound very natural to me. And you don't need to say Grace is curious - the reader can take that as read. Think it does need a little something overall - but if you are going to add a lot of Grace's emotions, then I think you have to be careful with how you do it - if there's a lot of "Grace felt shocked...Grace's heart began to thud" etc then I don't think that will actually make it more powerful. I wonder if you could add little details about what she does that let's the reader know that - details based on what she actually does?
 
aThenian said:
I actually like the way the plane crash happens and then is played down. I think that's more powerful in a way than a sort of standard disaster scene going straight into panic, flashing lights etc. Something bizarre and terrible happens - but then it's almost as if it didn't happen - leaving Grace and the reader wondering. Is it real or isn't it? And I like all the details about office life too and people getting on with things - sort of like the Titanic sinking but nobody realises yet. I also like that Grace feels disappointed that she isn't going to be first with the disaster news - that's very human. And humorous, in a way. I like the conjunction of plane crash and virus creating some mystery about how they are related
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Nice, you actually described it exactly the way I intended it... but obviously, for most readers it didn't work... and yes, I'm removing the first dialogue and making Grace more emotional. Thanks!
 
Jackie Bee said:
I had two professional editors look at my first chapters, and yet they didn't notice the problems you guys did. It really shows that a writing group could be very usefull.
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Where did you find these editors and what sort of editors were they (as in line editor/copy editor/story editor)? It's so important to get the right editor for your work! I think one that has a lot more experience than you is essential when starting out.
 
Alex Darion said:
Where did you find these editors and what sort of editors were they (as in line editor/copy editor/story editor)? It's so important to get the right editor for your work! I think one that has a lot more experience than you is essential when starting out.
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They did full edit - both line and content editing. Both were experienced, had edited books that had been published, and had written/published books of their own...
 
The story has potential. You have an interesting concept. That 'hook' makes your work potentially attractive to agents. There are some rough points in your prologue, but you should certainly not be disheartened.

Post some new material soon, and I am sure there will be lots of members willing to offer advice.

Good luck.
 
Have to agree with the others who have said ditch the prologue/chapter 1 'how did we get to where we are when the book opens' thing.

Far better to release that information in dribs and drabs throughout the story, in flashbacks, dreams, conversations that occur naturally in 'real time'. That way you keep the reader intrigued and guessing. As it stands now it's really just a glorified info-dump, and doesn't seem to add any vital information to a hypothetical second chapter set 20 years after the apocalypse.

It would be like Harry Potter opening with the scene where Voldemort killing James and Lily Potter. Think of all the potential for mystery and intrigue that would be ruined if as readers we knew from the very start exactly how that situation unfolded. It's a similar thing here. Leave your readers guessing and then release hints later, letting them fill in the gaps with their own imagination.

:)
 
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