Westworld

[Mr Orange]

just caught up to ep 7 and, well, wow...

some GoT'ish reveal there...

Spoiler

Okay, so without quite as much bloodshed maybe, but the Bernard reveal and death of Theresa were both completely unexpected for me. I was fully buying into Bernard's back story, his motives and character and also thought that Theresa would be in it for the long (or at least medium) haul. then, wait a minute, he's a host? oh, and her brains are decorating a wall now. and now we don't know who is a host and who isn't... also, even though you could guess it from his shifty eyes, the reveal of Ford as the evil(?) mastermind was good too.

a thought: maybe the whole "awakening" of the hosts is just code as well...

and where the hell is Elsie?

 

[Cli-Fi]

I'm starting to see what the Maze is, or at least what I think the maze is.

Spoiler

Delos is just another part of the maze. That's why everything seems so controlled and then not. That's why no one cares about the technicians. They think they are human. Bernard certainly did.

Ford has his hands in many more heads than just Bernard's in Delos. This whole thing might be a little Planet that Ford controls. WestWorld could take place far into the future and Ford is a terraformer/engineer. AKA God.

There are the player hosts:

Spoiler

Ford created the Maze to keep the checks and balances in the hosts that break their original coding and evolve. The maze is nothing special, its just there to keep the player hosts occupied.

Then there are the evolved or action hosts:

Spoiler

These are the hosts that Ford makes so that he doesn't need to actually hire anybody to work for him even though they all think they are human workers.

There's also another possibility of the emotion theory I had before Sunday Night's episode:

Spoiler

In that, the characters that show the most emotion are not hosts. AKA the technicians and the writer guy Lee Sizemore is human too.

What theory is true remains to be seen, but it's very exciting developments here.

Also anybody notice that Luke Hemsworth is Stubbs Head of Security?

 

[Frost Giant]

I thought this article had some interesting theories. It contains spoilers, of course.

Decoding Westworld’s Most Confusing Episode Yet

 

[Nate Hoffelder]

I thought this article had some interesting theories. It contains spoilers, of course.

Decoding Westworld’s Most Confusing Episode Yet

That was a level of crazy complicated which I don't think even "Lost" accomplished, but I think it could be true.

 

[BAYLOR]

I find my self empathizing with the Hosts , Maze and Delores in particular. I don't think I could go to a place like Westworld because I just couldn't bring myself to do any harm to the Hosts.

 

[Frost Giant]

That was a level of crazy complicated which I don't think even "Lost" accomplished, but I think it could be true.

I had a similar impression.

I don't think I could go to a place like Westworld because I just couldn't bring myself to do any harm to the Hosts.

I don't think guests are required to harm hosts. For the large sum of money they spend they can do anything they like. You could be a "white hat" and protect hosts from harm or you could just enjoy experiencing the park.

 

[Nate Hoffelder]

I just saw episode 8.

The theory mentioned in the linked Vanity Fair article is true.

 

[Frost Giant]

The more episodes I see, the more this show reminds me a lot of Joss Whedon's Dollhouse, which puts it in good company.

 

[Nate Hoffelder]

Dollhouse was a clever show which was never allowed to live up to the premise of the pilot.

And I agree, I can see the similarities.

 

[Cli-Fi]

I just saw episode 8.

The theory mentioned in the linked Vanity Fair article is true.

I do think the MIB is

Spoiler

William

. It would definitely help explain Dolores' visions and it would help bring the MIB's storyline into focus. When William

Spoiler

Killed Logan's Army and said he was ready to play the game and finally understood it. It's still the same game the MIB is playing! Dang that's a long game though.

 

[BAYLOR]

The more episodes I see, the more this show reminds me a lot of Joss Whedon's Dollhouse, which puts it in good company.

That's a very good comparison. I hope this show has a much longer run.

 

[Nate Hoffelder]

That is the one connection which has only been "mostly" confirmed.

 

[Mr Orange]

one issue i have with the theory above is

Spoiler

it relies on Dolores being in the same "homesteader" loop for 30 years. this seems unlikely, given how other hosts are moved around all the time. also, how did she get the same outfit in the MIB's time? in William's time she only got it because they went to Pariah and El Lazo gave the clothes to her. also, how could she have a vision/memory of herself being dead in the water?

and then there is the Wyatt storyline that Ford has constructed which supposedly ties in very well with what has actually happened in the past, which is odd, and if Dolores and Teddy had such a malfunction in the past, surely they would have been retired?

okay, so that's more than issue!

i do actually think the theory (or most of it at least) is true, but there seem to be inconsistencies

and i thought ep 9 was great! how many episodes do we have in this season?

 

[Nate Hoffelder]

Enough with the tags; I'm declaring this whole thread a spoiler zone.

Proceed at your own risk.
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We don't understand the whole story yet, this is true, but there are some details which are indisputable.

Bernard is a host based on one of the park's founders, Arnold.
Ford killed Arnold.
William is seen holding a photo in a later episode which had set off a host in one of the earlier episodes.
Dolores had metal guts in one episode - just like the early hosts.

So yes, we're watching a show set in at least two time periods, if not more.

 

[SilentRoamer]

Can one of the admins Spoiler tag the title please so we can have this as an open discussion thread?

Spoilers below:
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I think Dolores is showing us 3 timeframes:

The Dolores/William timeframe which is 30 years ago. (Internal mechanical parts)
The Dolores timeframe which is 35 years ago (The death of Arnold at the *suspected* hands of Dolores.)
The modern timeframe which is where we are seeing Maeve and the rest of the scenes (Arnold/Bernard, Elsie, the technicians)

Other items pointing to multiple timeframes:
The logo is different in the different times (You can see the WW logo is different)
William is now playing "the game"
The host who greets William is also the same host who killed Teddy and we know they don't use multiple versions of the same host simultaneously. The MiB even comments something like "You still here?" or words to that effect.
The MiB's monologues seem to match with what we know.
When William first enters the park he is asked whether or not he has any known illnesses yet in a previous episode Ford states that they had cured all diseases - these two factoids are incompatible.

 

[Nate Hoffelder]

Ooooooh, I had missed the logo!

Good catch!

 

[Mr Orange]

Ford killed Arnold.

is this indisputable?

The Dolores timeframe which is 35 years ago (The death of Arnold at the *suspected* hands of Dolores.)

or did Dolores (and Teddy) go nuts, kill everyone in Escalante, head down into the diagnostic facility and do a bit more killin', including Arnold? there seemed to be a lot dead "things" (people or hosts i wasn't sure on the first view) in the diagnostic facility when Dolores was down there in the MiB timeframe.

another question; why would Ford unearth Escalante and start the Wyatt narrative? is he trying to find answers too?

hmmm....

 

[Nate Hoffelder]

Ford had Bernard kill Elsie and Teresa.

Then Ford killed Bernard.

So yes, the most likely possibility is that Ford killed or had some one kill Arnold (- or at least he thinks he did. Arnold might have faked his death).

 

[Mr Orange]

this ^^^ i agree with, it is highly likely that Ford had Arnold killed. it was the "indisputable" i was disputing.

i am also beginning to think that Arnold may be living in the park somewhere.

 

[SilentRoamer]

So yes, the most likely possibility is that Ford killed or had some one kill Arnold (- or at least he thinks he did. Arnold might have faked his death).

I think the show has gone to pains to let us know that Arnold was the superior intellect between Ford and Arnold and that the most complex and beautiful elements of the code were written not by Ford but by Arnold.

My suspicion is that Ford and Arnold had a proxy war of sorts, based on their respective ideologies (Fords pessimism and belief that the hosts were his "to walk through the halls and corridors of his mind and burn it down if he wanted" whereas Arnold seems to have wanted to develop consciousness in the hosts and the emergence of sentience.

I don't have any explanations for the Wyatt narrative - although we don't really know that Fords new narrative is the Escalante narrative do we? Or it seems as if the narrative may have been visited before - after the MiB mentioned the city disappearing into the sands.

Does anyone here doubt that William is the MiB?

Wonder what will happen when Maeve confronts Ford and none of his backdoors work - unless this is just the latest in the "awakenings" and that all roads lead to Escalante. Although I suspect this is Arnolds coding coming to fruition because of Ford adding the Reveries which are allowing the hosts access to previous build programming (including Arnold code)