Dark days for Stargate SG-1 fans?
- Thread starter tealc
- Start date
Originally posted by nic
Hmmm I LOVE rootbeer!!! I went across to Florida twice and couldn't stop drinking the stuff!
The don't do rootbeer over here in the UK.
Closest thing is DoctorPepperhe's so misunderstood!
You have my deepest sympathies! :crying:
It can depend on where you are in the USA. Some places call it Sasparilla. Can I send you a 6-pack? It'll be nothing but fizz, but you'll know my heart was in the right place.
spookypumpkin
"happy oestrogen bubble"
- Joined
- Jan 9, 2001
- Messages
- 1,403
weeeelllll, this converation is going well; you're all either pissed, or VERY bored!
LOL LOL LOL ROTFLMAO Probably a little of both.
I like your style Spooky...... I gave up on it a while back. I do try to instigate discussions even to the point of insulting everyone, not just to get a reaction, but to provoke some debate, but some reaction would be cool.
Mind you, to be fair, even face to face conversations denigrate eventually!
:evil:
I like your style Spooky...... I gave up on it a while back. I do try to instigate discussions even to the point of insulting everyone, not just to get a reaction, but to provoke some debate, but some reaction would be cool.
Mind you, to be fair, even face to face conversations denigrate eventually!
:evil:
Originally posted by Anni
LOL LOL LOL ROTFLMAO Probably a little of both.
I like your style Spooky...... I gave up on it a while back. I do try to instigate discussions even to the point of insulting everyone, not just to get a reaction, but to provoke some debate, but some reaction would be cool.
Mind you, to be fair, even face to face conversations denigrate eventually!
:evil:
So how about that show Stargate? It's good, isn't it.
You want my opinion on Stargate? LOL.... how long have you got?
I discuss many aspects on many threads in a few forums, and I say the same every time. Stargate started off on a promise of a show with a wonderfully menacing, mysterious and highly dangerous enemy, and has turned into a Space Soap Opera in which the dangerous enemy have now become cariacatured, hilarious, camp and fit for nothing but pantomime while SG1 skip gaily through the Stargate and whack hell out of every single Jaffa and System Lord in sight.
No menace, no mystery, no exploration, no real venturing into why and how we all developed..... no alien cultures really.
None of what originally attracted me to the movie and the series. But I do keep watching in the hopes that they have a mental aberration and actually put something like that in, instead of it becoming "A Day Out Through the Stargate with Jack, Sam, Daniel and Teal'c"
Will that do?
:evil:
I discuss many aspects on many threads in a few forums, and I say the same every time. Stargate started off on a promise of a show with a wonderfully menacing, mysterious and highly dangerous enemy, and has turned into a Space Soap Opera in which the dangerous enemy have now become cariacatured, hilarious, camp and fit for nothing but pantomime while SG1 skip gaily through the Stargate and whack hell out of every single Jaffa and System Lord in sight.
No menace, no mystery, no exploration, no real venturing into why and how we all developed..... no alien cultures really.
None of what originally attracted me to the movie and the series. But I do keep watching in the hopes that they have a mental aberration and actually put something like that in, instead of it becoming "A Day Out Through the Stargate with Jack, Sam, Daniel and Teal'c"
Will that do?
:evil:I do agree with your view of the goa'uld's "easy kill" stories as I do with many of the posts you write.
You have to admit though, in order for shows to survive, they have to adapt. - That's how life goes.
Therefore I guess they adapt to what the audience wants.
Still, the audience is a fickle thing, and we act as if we are owed something at times.
Im losing my point here (it's late!) but I think what I was getting at is that although I love the 1st series, you can't expect the same format for 5 years, before long you're going to want to know a little something about these characters you have been following for so long.
It's called "identification" - to appeal to an individual, you have to have someone/thing they identify with.
...just some thoughts off the top of my head.
At the risk of becoming involved I just have to say that I think that some of this is unfair in my view.
I don't think that its become a space soap opera I think like nic said that you need that information on the characters and neither do I think that SG1 has just become about the characters.
I do agree that the enemy have become easy to kill but not really hilarious, camp and fit for nothing.
And neither do I think that SG1 skip gaily through the stargate (although the image is funny)
Pam
What can I say? Actually I know what 'identification' is Nic. And believe it or not, not everyone HAS to identify with characters in a show in order to keep watching it or for it to become/remain credible. You are making a remarkable assumption here about everyone else's take on this show. Making assumptions about other people can be a very dangerous occupation indeed.
Don't be too influenced by the hysteria displayed in many of the threads and many of the postings on the lists. I would say, and no offence meant here to anyone, that constantly having to identify with a character in order to enjoy a show is quite a 'naive' way of watching anything. I don't identify with characters, but I do often identify with concepts, which is I suppose why I don't indulge in hero/fan worship and never have. Not even when I was much younger. I don't believe in hankering after something which I would never have a chance of having. I find that extremely frustrating.
In my humble and obviously mistaken opinion, the original concept of the Stargate idea seemed to have been exploration, and investigation into the mysteries and origin of the human species. Of course there had to be a team which did this and it seemed logical that it would be at least two of the original people who had the adventure in the first instance. And the fans have gotten what they wanted. Characters they can identify with in order to make it a watchable series. But I still don't see why the mystery and the fear inspring menace had to be sacrificed in order for us to 'identify' with the characters.
Which of the remaining Goa'uld still retain that 'hair standing on end' impact that those Horus guards in the movie did, or Ra with his beautiful face and hideously ancient eyes? I disagree with you Pamie in that any of the enemy now retain any of that. The very fact that they are so simple for SG1 to take out has taken away that mystery and left us with, not an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and now aware that earth has developed into a threat, but an arrogant, stylised and pathetic bunch of wimps with an equally pathetic and inefficient bunch of Jaffa, who drop dead as soon as SG1 look at them. They have killed off characters that could have developed into some wonderful enemies indeed, and it has become a show in which the lesson of the day is 'How to kill a Goa'uld in 45 minutes'.
And please don't mention Apophis, because if you can't see that he has become one of the biggest TV joke characters ever, then I wonder which show it is you are watching.
I do know from trawling these lists that there is a very stylised form of fan worship going on and that my ideas are not in tune because mostly the fans are blinded by whatever the writers thrust at them. And by their adoration of anything SG1. And please don't tell me that this adoration doesn't exist. Because it does. In abundance. And usually among the female contingent. The male side tends to be a little more calm about it all.
I am sure there'll be protestations that this isn't the case, but anyone coming in cold to these lists, as my son did for instance, the other night, it is so obvious, and it put him off posting. He described it as 'a bunch of girlies sighing after something they can't have'. I'm not saying he's right, there are many who do try to debate the other aspects of this show, and I did tell him this, but first impressions apparently do count.
No matter what I say my opinions will not make any difference to the way you view the show. But you, the diehard fans, constantly have your say on these lists and I see no reason why I shouldn't have mine.
Or why I shouldn't put my desires forward for a decent, watchable, logical and credible show, which it promised to be, but now isn't.
After you all do, don't you? And because you are in the majority and I am in the minority doesn't make my opinions or wants any less viable. Please, I absolutely wish you to take this on board.
I am NOT saying that SG1 shouldn't be a focus of the show, or that they shouldn't have their characters developed in order to satisfy those who desperately yearn for this. Of COURSE there should be development. But not on the one sided level that there is now. There can be more than one focus in a show. Apophis would have been fine, if they hadn't killed him off and resurrected him so many times. All I am saying is that if you guys get your character development so you can identify with the show, why the heck can't people like me get the concept development as well? It HAS become just a day out through the Stargate for many of us. But I am not saying that, for what it has become, it isn't well done and well acted. And that's the only thing that keeps me watching now. Because I have really given up that they will do anything stir up my interest in the concept.
But I live in hope.
In any debate there needs to be someone like me who will stir up other thoughts in the minds of the debaters. That's what makes debating healthy. However, I am never going to turn into a drooling fan, because that's not who I am. And I am constantly going to question things, because that IS who I am.
Isn't that what these forums and lists are for? Have I got the wrong impression?
Don't be too influenced by the hysteria displayed in many of the threads and many of the postings on the lists. I would say, and no offence meant here to anyone, that constantly having to identify with a character in order to enjoy a show is quite a 'naive' way of watching anything. I don't identify with characters, but I do often identify with concepts, which is I suppose why I don't indulge in hero/fan worship and never have. Not even when I was much younger. I don't believe in hankering after something which I would never have a chance of having. I find that extremely frustrating.
In my humble and obviously mistaken opinion, the original concept of the Stargate idea seemed to have been exploration, and investigation into the mysteries and origin of the human species. Of course there had to be a team which did this and it seemed logical that it would be at least two of the original people who had the adventure in the first instance. And the fans have gotten what they wanted. Characters they can identify with in order to make it a watchable series. But I still don't see why the mystery and the fear inspring menace had to be sacrificed in order for us to 'identify' with the characters.
Which of the remaining Goa'uld still retain that 'hair standing on end' impact that those Horus guards in the movie did, or Ra with his beautiful face and hideously ancient eyes? I disagree with you Pamie in that any of the enemy now retain any of that. The very fact that they are so simple for SG1 to take out has taken away that mystery and left us with, not an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and now aware that earth has developed into a threat, but an arrogant, stylised and pathetic bunch of wimps with an equally pathetic and inefficient bunch of Jaffa, who drop dead as soon as SG1 look at them. They have killed off characters that could have developed into some wonderful enemies indeed, and it has become a show in which the lesson of the day is 'How to kill a Goa'uld in 45 minutes'.
And please don't mention Apophis, because if you can't see that he has become one of the biggest TV joke characters ever, then I wonder which show it is you are watching.
I do know from trawling these lists that there is a very stylised form of fan worship going on and that my ideas are not in tune because mostly the fans are blinded by whatever the writers thrust at them. And by their adoration of anything SG1. And please don't tell me that this adoration doesn't exist. Because it does. In abundance. And usually among the female contingent. The male side tends to be a little more calm about it all.
I am sure there'll be protestations that this isn't the case, but anyone coming in cold to these lists, as my son did for instance, the other night, it is so obvious, and it put him off posting. He described it as 'a bunch of girlies sighing after something they can't have'. I'm not saying he's right, there are many who do try to debate the other aspects of this show, and I did tell him this, but first impressions apparently do count.
No matter what I say my opinions will not make any difference to the way you view the show. But you, the diehard fans, constantly have your say on these lists and I see no reason why I shouldn't have mine.
Or why I shouldn't put my desires forward for a decent, watchable, logical and credible show, which it promised to be, but now isn't.
After you all do, don't you? And because you are in the majority and I am in the minority doesn't make my opinions or wants any less viable. Please, I absolutely wish you to take this on board.
I am NOT saying that SG1 shouldn't be a focus of the show, or that they shouldn't have their characters developed in order to satisfy those who desperately yearn for this. Of COURSE there should be development. But not on the one sided level that there is now. There can be more than one focus in a show. Apophis would have been fine, if they hadn't killed him off and resurrected him so many times. All I am saying is that if you guys get your character development so you can identify with the show, why the heck can't people like me get the concept development as well? It HAS become just a day out through the Stargate for many of us. But I am not saying that, for what it has become, it isn't well done and well acted. And that's the only thing that keeps me watching now. Because I have really given up that they will do anything stir up my interest in the concept.
But I live in hope.
In any debate there needs to be someone like me who will stir up other thoughts in the minds of the debaters. That's what makes debating healthy. However, I am never going to turn into a drooling fan, because that's not who I am. And I am constantly going to question things, because that IS who I am.
Isn't that what these forums and lists are for? Have I got the wrong impression?
imported_Sandman
confused
- Joined
- Oct 22, 2000
- Messages
- 688
Well, Anni, it's not as if we don't have plenty of droolers. i my self have occasionally enjoyed doing so as well. It's interesting to read your viewpoint on things, even if i don't agree with everything.
I do however agree with you on some things. The quick and rather pathetic fall of the system lords, for one thing.
In the beginning apophis was a true villian's villian, but now he is merely a joke. Sokar was good, even more menacing than Apophis ever was, but he never truly got the opportunity to show it. Again, too, with Cronus.
As for the characters' personal lives, well, i do like to know a bit about the person behind the soldier/scientist/alien, but i don't think it should rule the show. which it hasn't--it might have come close in parts of season four with the whole sam/jack thing, but it is a far cry from a soap opera in my opinion. The show is titled 'sg-1' and i would assume that it would revolve around that team--that includes personal lives. Otherwise it could just be called stargate. Character development is important when your with the same four to six people every week.
I wish the writers could find an even balance. but i guess there's a greater viewer demand for one, more than the other. whatever, i still like the show. the elements are mixed about as evenly as they're ever gonna get.
i debate a lot better in person.
(the opinion of this personality in no way reflects the opinions of my other personalities and is not intended to offend anyone.)
I do however agree with you on some things. The quick and rather pathetic fall of the system lords, for one thing.
In the beginning apophis was a true villian's villian, but now he is merely a joke. Sokar was good, even more menacing than Apophis ever was, but he never truly got the opportunity to show it. Again, too, with Cronus.
As for the characters' personal lives, well, i do like to know a bit about the person behind the soldier/scientist/alien, but i don't think it should rule the show. which it hasn't--it might have come close in parts of season four with the whole sam/jack thing, but it is a far cry from a soap opera in my opinion. The show is titled 'sg-1' and i would assume that it would revolve around that team--that includes personal lives. Otherwise it could just be called stargate. Character development is important when your with the same four to six people every week.
I wish the writers could find an even balance. but i guess there's a greater viewer demand for one, more than the other. whatever, i still like the show. the elements are mixed about as evenly as they're ever gonna get.
i debate a lot better in person.
(the opinion of this personality in no way reflects the opinions of my other personalities and is not intended to offend anyone.)
*sigh*...... But that's my point. The elements aren't actually mixed at all. And yes, the droolers hold sway. Or seem to, at least. And the damage has been done regarding the System Lords. There is no way they could pull it back now and I get very frustrated about that.
I guess I have a problem with drooling, and I have trouble understanding why people do it. It wouldn't make me feel better or make me like a show any more. But I can see that some folk need to do it. Perhaps they perceive that there is some element missing from their own lives and personalities which is fulfilled by watching and applauding others who seem to be fulfilling their lives.... I don't know. That's getting into the human psyche very deeply and I am not qualified to do that. But I do know it's why we have heroes and heroines and why we insist on placing people on pedestals.... it's also why we greatly enjoy watching them fall off!
Maybe its because I have always gone out and actually attempted to do exciting, different and strange things... I was one of the first female British soldiers trained as a combat soldier for instance. It was a huge and difficult challenge, not least for the fact that I had to constantly prove myself to the male soldiers around me, but for me, it wasn't enough to know that there were people out there who did that. I wanted to see for myself whether I could do it.
I don't mean to imply that we all have unfulfilled lives on this list, although up to a point if we didn't we would be out there doing something more interesting than posting. And many people post a lot....
Ive done a lot in my 50 years on this planet, possibly more than many, although it doesn't seem that way to me at all. All of it has involved me pushing myself to the limits. None of it has involved gratuitous hero worship. And I don't use TV shows or movies for that either.
I just wish there WAS a mixing of the elements in this show, which held such promise and is now, just a reasonably good and relatively entertaining TV show. Which I suppose *wry grin* is what the Stargate Production people started out to achieve in the first place. I don't think for one minute they anticipated the furore which has accompanied its' progress!
I guess I have a problem with drooling, and I have trouble understanding why people do it. It wouldn't make me feel better or make me like a show any more. But I can see that some folk need to do it. Perhaps they perceive that there is some element missing from their own lives and personalities which is fulfilled by watching and applauding others who seem to be fulfilling their lives.... I don't know. That's getting into the human psyche very deeply and I am not qualified to do that. But I do know it's why we have heroes and heroines and why we insist on placing people on pedestals.... it's also why we greatly enjoy watching them fall off!
Maybe its because I have always gone out and actually attempted to do exciting, different and strange things... I was one of the first female British soldiers trained as a combat soldier for instance. It was a huge and difficult challenge, not least for the fact that I had to constantly prove myself to the male soldiers around me, but for me, it wasn't enough to know that there were people out there who did that. I wanted to see for myself whether I could do it.
I don't mean to imply that we all have unfulfilled lives on this list, although up to a point if we didn't we would be out there doing something more interesting than posting. And many people post a lot....
Ive done a lot in my 50 years on this planet, possibly more than many, although it doesn't seem that way to me at all. All of it has involved me pushing myself to the limits. None of it has involved gratuitous hero worship. And I don't use TV shows or movies for that either.
I just wish there WAS a mixing of the elements in this show, which held such promise and is now, just a reasonably good and relatively entertaining TV show. Which I suppose *wry grin* is what the Stargate Production people started out to achieve in the first place. I don't think for one minute they anticipated the furore which has accompanied its' progress!
Hi guys, my computer isn't being too friendly with me today, but hopefully this post will final get here! 3rd time lucky! Fingers crossed!
Actually, I've never really had one either (except for my parents). I can see though why many people do look up to people and fictional characters. Using myself as an example, when I watch characters such as Sam Carter, Dana Scully (to name but two) I don't see someone I wish to be, but I see a strong female characters with many admirable qualities.
I can understand why many would see them as rolemodels.
I enjoy watching character development because it's one aspect of my career in animation production. It's something I enjoy working on and appreciate the time and skill that goes into writing a character that an audience can emotionally feel for.
Plus it's even harder to make a cartoon character seem real.
...I guess I'm a little sensitive around this subject!
I share your opinion here! The guy has more lives than a cat!
Why do you think it is that they keep him in the show?
I'd say it's because he was in the series from day one, making him the big old archenemy of the SGC.
But like you wrote, he has become more of a joke, along with many of the other System Lords.
Thor reveals how the system lords battle among themselves for power/territory - so you would think they wouldn't have an arrogant opinion of each other and therefore they would be heavily defended from each other, but somehow SG1, a team of 4 can some how walk straight in and wipe the bad guy out in the space of an hour! How did they system lords take control of the galaxy?
Anni you shouldn't be down hearted.
I respect your opinions and enjoy the debates that you enter.
Don't think that your views fall on deaf ears - I listen.
Like yourself, I like to question, understand, and examine especially when it comes to televison and film.
In saying that, I do also engage in the more lighthearted posts too. IMHO, it's just a bit of fun and discussion.
You're going to the UK convention aren't you Anni? I hope to go, maybe if I do you can spar with me It's all healthy and fun!
Nic x x
Firstly, sorry Anni. That didn't mean to come across at all in any offensive manner. I'm just used to using little "quotations" all the time from my film theory course. Sorry again x x
Really? You never had a sort of role model in that sense?
Actually, I've never really had one either (except for my parents). I can see though why many people do look up to people and fictional characters. Using myself as an example, when I watch characters such as Sam Carter, Dana Scully (to name but two) I don't see someone I wish to be, but I see a strong female characters with many admirable qualities.
I can understand why many would see them as rolemodels.
I enjoy watching character development because it's one aspect of my career in animation production. It's something I enjoy working on and appreciate the time and skill that goes into writing a character that an audience can emotionally feel for.
Plus it's even harder to make a cartoon character seem real.
...I guess I'm a little sensitive around this subject!
I share your opinion here! The guy has more lives than a cat!
Why do you think it is that they keep him in the show?
I'd say it's because he was in the series from day one, making him the big old archenemy of the SGC.
But like you wrote, he has become more of a joke, along with many of the other System Lords.
Thor reveals how the system lords battle among themselves for power/territory - so you would think they wouldn't have an arrogant opinion of each other and therefore they would be heavily defended from each other, but somehow SG1, a team of 4 can some how walk straight in and wipe the bad guy out in the space of an hour! How did they system lords take control of the galaxy?
Anni you shouldn't be down hearted.
I respect your opinions and enjoy the debates that you enter.
Don't think that your views fall on deaf ears - I listen.
Like yourself, I like to question, understand, and examine especially when it comes to televison and film.
In saying that, I do also engage in the more lighthearted posts too. IMHO, it's just a bit of fun and discussion.
You're going to the UK convention aren't you Anni? I hope to go, maybe if I do you can spar with me
It's all healthy and fun!Nic x x
Originally posted by tealc
I think beliving in any sort of God is the stupidest thing humans have ever invented, (Except Pokemon).
To all those God belivers on this forum, (Poor guys), please dont flame me.:angryfire
I know for as a fact that there is no god.
If you do belive in a god, then when you die you'll be in for a shock. (Oh, I forgot. You cant feel shocked when you die cos theres nothing after death).:dead:
Well there is the famous dictum by Pascal (famous French philosopher) that if you believe in God and you die and there is no God, you don't lose anything, because there is no God, there is no afterlife.
But if you don't believe in God and there IS a God, then you were wrong all your life. So from that point of view, believers can't be wrong. I think a lot of people may get a big surprise when they die. And a lot of good people like Mother Theresa have believed in God and a lot of reallly bad people like Stalin and Hitler.didn't.:dead:
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