The Revived Tolkien Trivia

[Marky Lazer]

I'm becoming more disappointed all the time, Mr Pyan...

 

[Grimward]

Well, it takes a bit to connect the dots here limiting the search to only the approved sources (which possibly is your point, Mr. Marky sir), but I'll have a go at it:

When C.S. Lewis and I tossed up, and he was to write on space-travel and I on time-travel, I began an abortive book of time-travel of which the end was to be the presence of my hero in the drowning of Atlantis. This was to be called Númenor, the Land in the West. The thread was to be the occurrence time and again in human families (like Durin among the Dwarves) of a father and son called by names that could be interpreted as Bliss-friend and Elf-friend. These no longer understood are found in the end to refer to the Atlantid-Númenórean situation and mean 'one loyal to friendship with the High-elves'. It started with a father-son affinity between Edwin and Elwin of the present, and was supposed to go back into legendary time by way of an Eädwine and Ælfwine of circa A.D. 918, and Audoin and Alboin of Lombardic legend, and so the traditions of the North Sea concerning the coming of corn and culture heroes, ancestors of kingly lines, in boats (and their departure in funeral ships). One such Sheaf, or Shield Sheafing, can actually be made out as one of the remote ancestors of our present Queen. In my tale we were to come at last to Amandil and Elendil, leaders of the loyal party in Númenor, when it fell under the domination of Sauron.

The Letters of J.R.R. Tolkien, Letter #257 To Christopher Bretherton

This establishes Ælfwine as Elendil in Tolkien's tale....

But when Amandil heard rumour of the evil purpose of Sauron he was grieved to the heart, knowing that in the end Sauron would surely have his will. Then he spoke to Elendil and the sons of Elendil, recalling the tale of the Trees of Valinor; and Isildur said no word, but went out by night and did a deed for which he was afterwards renowned.

The Silmarillion, Akallabêth

And this establishes Amandil (né Audoin, né Eädwine) as he who told Elendil (né Alboin né Ælfwine) the legends that later became The Silmarillion.

(perhaps?)

 

[HareBrain]

When C.S. Lewis and I tossed up, and he was to write on space-travel and I on time-travel, I began an abortive book of time-travel of which the end was to be the presence of my hero in the drowning of Atlantis. This was to be called Númenor, the Land in the West. The thread was to be the occurrence time and again in human families (like Durin among the Dwarves) of a father and son called by names that could be interpreted as Bliss-friend and Elf-friend. These no longer understood are found in the end to refer to the Atlantid-Númenórean situation and mean 'one loyal to friendship with the High-elves'. It started with a father-son affinity between Edwin and Elwin of the present, and was supposed to go back into legendary time by way of an Eädwine and Ælfwine of circa A.D. 918, and Audoin and Alboin of Lombardic legend, and so the traditions of the North Sea concerning the coming of corn and culture heroes, ancestors of kingly lines, in boats (and their departure in funeral ships). One such Sheaf, or Shield Sheafing, can actually be made out as one of the remote ancestors of our present Queen. In my tale we were to come at last to Amandil and Elendil, leaders of the loyal party in Númenor, when it fell under the domination of Sauron.


The Letters of J.R.R. Tolkien, Letter #257 To Christopher Bretherton

This establishes Ælfwine as Elendil in Tolkien's tale....

Or you could have used the index and been sent straight to:

Elendil (=Ælfwine, Elf-friend)

Letters #156

(But I couldn't find the second one)

 

[Marky Lazer]

Gee, I can only applaud your effort Mr Grim, weren't it for the fact that it's not what I'm looking for. I mean the real Aelfwine (note the normal capital A followed by a normal lowercase e instead of those odd coalescing letters, too)...

 

[Marky Lazer]

Okay, I'm trying to think of a hint, but it's not as easy to think of a good one; gimme a minute!

 

[Marky Lazer]

There now... I'm trying to steer you to the meaning of the name of the person (starting with a P) I'm looking for. Be sure to search in The Silmarillion's word lists.... The hint is, though still somewhat obscure, I think: "Maeglin is not one."

 

[Marky Lazer]

Still no clue? Well then...

Hint: "Maeglin is not one" refers to:

But when he [Maeglin] declared his purpose to Eöl, his father was wrathful. 'You are of the house of Eöl, my son,' he said, 'and not of the Golodhrim.'

The Silmarillion, Chapter 16: Of Maeglin.

Hint 2: Be sure to search in The Silmarillion's words lists...

Golodhrim: The Noldor. Golodh was the Sindarin form of Quenya Noldo[.]

I wanted you to take golod(h) as the latter part of the name. Now put a first part in front of it starting with a P, please...

 

[Grimward]

Well, I certainly had to be led by the nose on this one, Marky. I'd locked in on the Maeglin hint easy enough, but then wandered off looking for some forsaken Noldo with a name beginning with 'P'. I think this is what you are looking for, minus the 'h; in golodh....

The long tales out of which it is drawn (by 'Pengolod') are either incomplete or not up to date.

The Fall of Gondolin
The Lay of Beren and Lúthien (verse)
The Children of Húrin

I am distressed (for myself) to be unable to find the 'Rings of Power', which with the 'Fall of Númenor' is the link between The Silmarillion and the Hobbit World.

The Letters of J.R.R. Tolkien, #115, To Katherine Farrer

and, to close the loop on Aelfwine, the corresponding end note, "Pengolod" was:

An Elvish sage in Tol Eressëa from whom the mariner Aelfwine heard the legends that make up The Silmarillion; see Biography pp. 90, 169.

Endnote [115] 1 to the quote above, also in Letters.

 

[Marky Lazer]

That is correct, Grim. Tingaling and the floor is yours.

 

[Grimward]

Thank you, sir. A well-hidden nugget, that....

A possibly easier offering: From whence comes the leaping light?

 

[Marky Lazer]

It left the world and took its flight
over the wide seas of the night.
The moon set sail upon the gale,
and stars were fanned to leaping light.

The Hobbit, ch. 7 Queer Lodgings.

 

[Grimward]

'Tis, Marky. A leaping bell, ringing in the breeze to you, along with the floor....

 

[Marky Lazer]

Thank, Grimmy. Now where do we find "woven woods"?

 

[Clansman]

I think "woven woods" would be found in Doriath, where Luthien Tinuviel was dancing when Beren first saw her, thought the text specifically refers to "Elvenhome":

Enchantment healed his weary feet
That over hills were doomed to roam;
And forth he hastened, strong and fleet,
And grasped at moonbeams glistening.
Through woven woods in Elvenhome
She lightly fled on dancing feet,
And left him lonely still to roam
In the silent forest listening.

From The Fellowship of the Ring, Book I, Chapter 11 "A Knife in the Dark", pp. 208-209.

I believe it can also be found in The Lays of Beleriand, vol 3 (I think) of The History of Middle Earth, but I didn't look.

 

[Marky Lazer]

It's quite a common phrase, Clanny, and as far as I know, always refers to Doriath indeed. That's a bell then.

 

[Clansman]

I will post a question later. I am at work, and have removed all Tolkien's works from my work space. The Chrons is a bad enough distraction without having my favourite books around.

 

[Grimward]

And Ms. Clanny (the power behind the throne?) has banished the Chrons from the homefront?

 

[Marky Lazer]

Give the shellfish a break! What? Oh, that's clams, is it?

 

[Grimward]

Clams is right, Marky; certainly keeping mum on the next challenge.

Or perhaps we need to rescue you from the clutches of your employment, Clanny?

*Winds the horn of Helm*

Helm! Helm to the Clansman.....

 

[Marky Lazer]

I really hope we get a question about shellfish!