United Agents open house submissions

[S Blake-Smy]

I'm new and just read this post from one end to the other and now I feel sad I was in bed but now I'm gonna get up and write. commiserations to all of you. my turn soon.

It's funny what acts as an impetus to write! If this acts as an inspiration to you, then I feel all the better for my rejection. Good luck to you!

I feel I am able to put my opening 1000 words up for a crit now that this is all over... hope to get the criticism I wanted from the submission, I can only get better if I know where I am doing badly.

 

[Stephen Thompson]

I will read it and do my best to give any pointers if I have anything.

Back up on the horse you go.

Except imagine it's a walrus instead. with a saddle on.

Willie the Writing Walrus.

He smokes a pipe and writes on an old typewriter.

I'll stop now

 

[Enshanta]

Commiserations on all the R's. Just remember, every day we are moving nearer to being published! (Somewhere!)

 

[aThenian]

I think these "open house" things, either with publishers or agents, are a massive lottery. I've tried a few, along with folk from here and from RL whose writing skills I respect, and don't know anyone who has got anywhere. It's not just about being good, it's about chiming with someone who reads the manuscript so that you spark an interest (which depends on personal taste) and then on them also thinking they can sell the manuscript, which depends on trends in publishing etc etc. I think a better approach might be to go to Conventions where you can meet agents/editors and submit that way, rather than as part of a very impersonal slush pile process. Though I'm more and more thinking that self-publishing is the way for me personally.

Another issue is every "open submissions" thing I've done has always massively overrun - one took over a year! Even if you start off a hard-headed realist, and even forget you entered, as time ticks on it's very hard not to get over-invested in it - "Wow I must be in the last handful of submissions now, the deadline was two months ago"- and then feel crushed by the rejection.

I've had some encouraging feedback from some of them, but still, I think I might try and resist entering next time!

Then again, I'd miss out on my virtual chocolate.

Good luck to all and let's none of us forget there are other ways to get our stuff out there!

 

[AnyaKimlin]

I made it through the BBC one. I was the only new writer on it though. Everyone else was an established but not had a big break in comedy. (They could however sell out a gig at the Edinburgh Fringe Festival or they've since gone on to produce TV etc)

 

[Lynn M Love author]

I think these "open house" things, either with publishers or agents, are a massive lottery. I've tried a few, along with folk from here and from RL whose writing skills I respect, and don't know anyone who has got anywhere. It's not just about being good, it's about chiming with someone who reads the manuscript so that you spark an interest (which depends on personal taste) and then on them also thinking they can sell the manuscript, which depends on trends in publishing etc etc. I think a better approach might be to go to Conventions where you can meet agents/editors and submit that way, rather than as part of a very impersonal slush pile process. Though I'm more and more thinking that self-publishing is the way for me personally.

Another issue is every "open submissions" thing I've done has always massively overrun - one took over a year! Even if you start off a hard-headed realist, and even forget you entered, as time ticks on it's very hard not to get over-invested in it - "Wow I must be in the last handful of submissions now, the deadline was two months ago"- and then feel crushed by the rejection.

I've had some encouraging feedback from some of them, but still, I think I might try and resist entering next time!

Then again, I'd miss out on my virtual chocolate.

Good luck to all and let's none of us forget there are other ways to get our stuff out there!

Still very confused about the trad vs self-pub route. Have had conversations on other forums where folk are still of the opinion that self-pub may be an obstacle to being picked up by a trad publisher - unless you sell in huge numbers. Sell in modest numbers and you've single handedly proven you can't self-promote (something we all need to be good at, as we know) and that the public aren't interested enough in your work to make it worthwhile for a publisher to back you.
What do you think @aThenian? Bearing in mind this conversation was had with American writers - is the situation different over there?

 

[aThenian]

Still very confused about the trad vs self-pub route. Have had conversations on other forums where folk are still of the opinion that self-pub may be an obstacle to being picked up by a trad publisher - unless you sell in huge numbers. Sell in modest numbers and you've single handedly proven you can't self-promote (something we all need to be good at, as we know) and that the public aren't interested enough in your work to make it worthwhile for a publisher to back you.
What do you think @aThenian? Bearing in mind this conversation was had with American writers - is the situation different over there?

It's not an easy choice. There are quite a few self-pubbing threads on here where people discuss the pros and cons - I would take a look.

Myself, I think trad publishing is best if all goes well - but often it doesn't, most trad published books disappear quietly, and you have very little control. It's just the lap of the gods. S-pubbing you do at least (theoretically) have more control, but you are stuck trying to do everything yourself.

 

[Boneman]

Since I didn't have a 'yes-we've-pilled-your-submission' or a rejection, this one could run for years!!

 

[Serendipity]

Since I didn't have a 'yes-we've-pilled-your-submission' or a rejection, this one could run for years!!

I suppose it would be sensible for you to query one of their assistants to ask about where your novel is in their great scheme of things... but letting things be will be more fun... or should I say suspenseful?

 

[Stephen Thompson]

You could try both. Self publish one manuscript and attempt to trad-pub a second (if you're a busy busy bumble bee and have more than one manuscript to choose from).

I'd attempt them both at the same time and when you're doing the trad, mention that you also have a self published work either on Amazon or in the pipeline, then, if they say "oh, that's interesting; you're motivated and capable of self-starting" then they're happy about it, or, "oh, that's interesting; we don't normally deal with self-pubs" then you'll know, roughly, how badly they would have strapped you down with the contract and sure, it might be the reason for your rejection but better that than if they don't know you've done the Amazon thing and find out waaaay after the contract and use it as an excuse to bust out and not pay you (if it had gotten that far)

From what I've read (and I've read extensively), it's going to be good and bad at the same time no matter what way you go. So listen to your gut first and see what it wants (not food, after food ).

If it were me doing it now, I'd write two lists; one containing the tasks I have to complete to self publish, along with the potential costs, and another with the things you must do to trad publish. Next to each item, give it a score between 1 and 3; to mark how confident you feel about each task, where 1 is "i can't do this" and 3 is "am gonna nail this bit" and 2 being indifferent. Do it for all tasks, in both list and then add up the scores and do the thing with the highest score. It's my plan for when I'm done editing and polishing, as I don't know which way am gonna go yet.


If you do the pros/cons type list, don't forget to add "potential rejection" onto it, and score it based on how well you think you'd handle a rejection.

just my 2p

 

[EJDeBrun]

good luck Boneman! On free yourself from limbo! Let us know the results if you get any!

 

[Dan Jones]

Boneman, you'll never be free now! You're trapped in the infernal purgatory of the submissions sector of the publishing industry... FOREVER! BWAHAHAHAHAHA!

 

[Jo Zebedee]

I am a hybrid writer - I publish traditionally and self published. A few observations (for longer, more boring ones I blog at jozebwrites.blogspot.co.uk):

1. No traditional publisher has had any problem, whatsoever, with me being self published. The only time you will have a problem is when you shoot below your weight eg you get a huge deal and don't get the sales to fulfil it. If you can get a book out and establish any sort of a platform, you will have done more than most writers ever do.

2. People do get picked up from open windows. I have several writer friends, who have done - and one who got their agent from a pitch contest. It does happen. However, your chances are extremely small and the windows tend to be quite narrow in terms of what they are looking for, from a marketing perspective. For me, I had more interest going the agent route than the open window route. (Or, actually, that might not be quite true. I did get an agent, so the success was high - although I'm not agented currently - but from the open windows 2 of the 3 I entered took me right to the final entrants. But getting kicked out at 3% left, or being told your mss was considered and narrowly rejected, isn't, actually, any better than getting kicked out on day one. And considerably more stressful.)

3. Stickability. I'm planning to do my blog on this, this week - and have been since Monday. This gig is hard. It is slow. Writing the book is only the first of many difficult steps. If you allow yourself to stop writing because the odds are so against you, you will join the many, many, who just could not - for whatever reasons, myriad and varied - keep going. The writers who succeed are the ones who didn't give up. Who kept writing until they had a book, who brought it out no matter how hard the market was or is, in whatever format they could. There really is no other secret but gritting one's teeth in the face of rejection and keep writing.

 

[Tirellan]

But getting kicked out at 3% left, or being told your mss was considered and narrowly rejected, isn't, actually, any better than getting kicked out on day one

I disagree. It tells you that your manuscript is very close and you are not in fact delusional in trying to get it published/agented. Such validation is my view is important in keeping you going and stopping you from burning the whole lot.

 

[Jo Zebedee]

But getting kicked out at 3% left, or being told your mss was considered and narrowly rejected, isn't, actually, any better than getting kicked out on day one

I disagree. It tells you that your manuscript is very close and you are not in fact delusional in trying to get it published/agented. Such validation is my view is important in keeping you going and stopping you from burning the whole lot.

Well, yes, there is that.

 

[AnyaKimlin]

I disagree. It tells you that your manuscript is very close and you are not in fact delusional in trying to get it published/agented. Such validation is my view is important in keeping you going and stopping you from burning the whole lot.

Actually, I started to find it harder.

I had so much personal feedback, came close with several agents only to be told whilst my work was good enough it was never going to be suitable for traditional publishing. The first was fantastic - to be told I had talent, my work was original, my voice had verve and panache etc that gave me a buzz. The second that loved the characters but objected to present tense was great. I made some of the changes they suggested, but decided Angus (my MC) didn't work in past tense and there was no way would he work as a mediaeval prince. For me they were changes that would ruin the story. By the time I got to 15+ agents telling me how good it was but... I began to realise no matter what I did with the book it was never going to happen that way.

Angus is now starting to prove the agents wrong on my blog. A couple of better known authors retweet his latest instalment every week and he's picking up about 10-20 new readers a week (I consider those that go back and start reading from chapter one to the latest chapter, new readers). This week 90+ readers read him within the first hour of me putting him up. I get a lot of satisfaction out of Mayhem doing well more so than any other book as it has a certain two fingers up feel to it.

 

[Stewart Hotston]

What I love about this thread is that so many people took part and the level of general support is awesome. I've only just arrived and so wish I'd found this community years ago!

 

[Lynn M Love author]

Actually, I started to find it harder.

I had so much personal feedback, came close with several agents only to be told whilst my work was good enough it was never going to be suitable for traditional publishing. The first was fantastic - to be told I had talent, my work was original, my voice had verve and panache etc that gave me a buzz. The second that loved the characters but objected to present tense was great. I made some of the changes they suggested, but decided Angus (my MC) didn't work in past tense and there was no way would he work as a mediaeval prince. For me they were changes that would ruin the story. By the time I got to 15+ agents telling me how good it was but... I began to realise no matter what I did with the book it was never going to happen that way.

Angus is now starting to prove the agents wrong on my blog. A couple of better known authors retweet his latest instalment every week and he's picking up about 10-20 new readers a week (I consider those that go back and start reading from chapter one to the latest chapter, new readers). This week 90+ readers read him within the first hour of me putting him up. I get a lot of satisfaction out of Mayhem doing well more so than any other book as it has a certain two fingers up feel to it.

Just visited your blog @AnyaKimlin . You're so prolific - amazing! I'm so glad you've kept going with your writing after having so much positive feedback and I can only imagine how hard it is to keep being told 'you're great but ...' so often. I do hope you garner the success your writing deserves. All the best

 

[Lynn M Love author]

I am a hybrid writer - I publish traditionally and self published. A few observations (for longer, more boring ones I blog at jozebwrites.blogspot.co.uk):

1. No traditional publisher has had any problem, whatsoever, with me being self published. The only time you will have a problem is when you shoot below your weight eg you get a huge deal and don't get the sales to fulfil it. If you can get a book out and establish any sort of a platform, you will have done more than most writers ever do.

2. People do get picked up from open windows. I have several writer friends, who have done - and one who got their agent from a pitch contest. It does happen. However, your chances are extremely small and the windows tend to be quite narrow in terms of what they are looking for, from a marketing perspective. For me, I had more interest going the agent route than the open window route. (Or, actually, that might not be quite true. I did get an agent, so the success was high - although I'm not agented currently - but from the open windows 2 of the 3 I entered took me right to the final entrants. But getting kicked out at 3% left, or being told your mss was considered and narrowly rejected, isn't, actually, any better than getting kicked out on day one. And considerably more stressful.)

3. Stickability. I'm planning to do my blog on this, this week - and have been since Monday. This gig is hard. It is slow. Writing the book is only the first of many difficult steps. If you allow yourself to stop writing because the odds are so against you, you will join the many, many, who just could not - for whatever reasons, myriad and varied - keep going. The writers who succeed are the ones who didn't give up. Who kept writing until they had a book, who brought it out no matter how hard the market was or is, in whatever format they could. There really is no other secret but gritting one's teeth in the face of rejection and keep writing.

Thanks @Jo Zebedee for the full reply. Your experiences are really interesting. The author who told me she had a negative reponse about self pub authors at a writing conference was American so I'm wondering if the self pub sector is viewed differently over there - perhaps our industry is more accepting? I know you're right, that sticking with it is the only way to find success in such a tough market and I won't stop writing because I love the process too damn much! I might never be successful financially, but at least I've completed a handful of books, which as you say, most haven't

 

[AnyaKimlin]

Just visited your blog @AnyaKimlin . You're so prolific - amazing! I'm so glad you've kept going with your writing after having so much positive feedback and I can only imagine how hard it is to keep being told 'you're great but ...' so often. I do hope you garner the success your writing deserves. All the best

Thanks. I remain hopeful my writing will get somewhere but also I've had experiences which mean I am now sure I don't want to start traditionally published but may try again next year.