Pure Speculation RE; A Song of Ice and Fire.

[Winters_Sorrow]

I am of course waiting for the revelation that all of the Stark Direwolves are in fact possessed by the Children of the Forest, who are in turn being Warged by Arya, Jon and (more successfully) by Bran. The "three-eyed" crow in linked to each Stark via his wolf, as it were - with only Bran being 'chosen' to be guided so far.

As an aside, those abilities have a killer range, don't they? Arya was still having wolf dreams in Braavos! Compare that with Jon who could barely spot Ghost until he was nearly right on top of him so it seems to me that in terms of abilities we have Jon > Arya > Bran.

Until King Rickon the First comes charging out of the forests with an army of wolves, shadowcats, lizardlions, eagles, mammoths and who knows what at his beck and call

 

[Ursa major]

...so it seems to me that in terms of abilities we have Jon > Arya > Bran.

Wouldn't that be Bran > Arya > Jon ? (Or Jon < Arya < Bran ?)

Until King Rickon the First comes charging out of the forests with an army of wolves, shadowcats, lizardlions, eagles, mammoths and who knows what at his beck and call

Not Davos (the possibly Dead)?

 

[Boaz]

WS, I think you mean Bran > Arya > Jon. [Edit: That darn, but oh so cute, bear beat me on my post. I need to type faster!]

But I also imagined Jon's lack of communication with Ghost to be caused by The Wall. It is magic. It cannot be undone except by the magic Horn of Winter. Wights and Others cannot pass through it. I just thought that The Wall caused magic interference thus creating static interference between Jon and Ghost's magic connection.

Another crazy thing I believe is that House Baelish is a ******* offshoot of House Targaryen.

First, House Baelish was established during Targaryen rule.

Second, how did the least of the lords (if you could even call Petyr's father a lord... is Hedge Lord a term?) of the Vale come to get his son fostered to Hoster Tully? At that time Tully was one of the seven great lords of the kingdom, in fact you could argue that he was in the top four (Jon Arryn, Tywin Lannister, and mayhaps Doran Martell). All the river lords, including Walder Frey would have begged and bribed to get their sons fostered by the Lord Paramount of the Trident. Neither Benjen Stark, Jaime Lannister, Oberyn Martell, Quentyn Martell, Robb Stark, Robert Arryn, nor I presume any of the Tyrell boys recieved a fostering as notable as Petyr Baelish.

Third, the ae combination in Baelish could be an acknoledgement of a Targaryen progenitor. King Baelor the Blessed. Crown Prince Baelor Breakspear.

Enoch, Welcome! I had not thought of Sansa seducing Sandor. I had not pictured her going full Cersei on a piece in the Game. Interesting.

 

[IlliferThePenniless]

Two crackpot theories for your Thursday's enjoyment:

1) Lord Leyton Hightower of Oldtown is actually Marwin the mage. Lord Leyton stays in his tower, supposedly unseen for years. What better cover so he could exist in the world as a disreputable maester with a thirst for magic, all without soiling his house's honor.

2) The three betrayals that Dany will know are, in fact betrayals she'll commit, not betrayals she'll suffer. She's already betrayed Drogo for love after all. i'm kind of fascinated by the fact that we're about to see her for the first time through another 's eyes, and i'm genuinely curious if she'll seem much less appealing as seen through Tyrion's eyes then her own.

 

[Boaz]

Spoiler Alert!!! But if you're reading in this thread, you probably already know everything.

So... Dany could be the betrayer thrice over?!?!

She betrayed Drogo's love by allowing Mirri to poison Drogo. Or she betrayed Drogo's love by killing him. Or she betrayed Drogo's love by sacrificing his child, the Dothraki of the great prophecy.

Dany's other betrayals are for money and vengeance, I believe.

Dany reneged on the Good Masters (or was it the Wise Masters) over the purchase of the Unsullied. That sounds like treachery to me.

Now there is only betrayal for vengeance left...

We know Dany hates Eddard Stark, Robert Baratheon, Tywin Lannister, and Jaime Lannister above all the people of the Seven Kingdoms. Jaime happens to be the only one still alive. But as the child of Aerys II who was "betrayed" by the above men, Dany could take her vengeance by betraying their offspring. The candidates are Robert Arryn (his paternity may not be what it is claimed to be), Sansa, Arya, Bran, Rickon, Tyrion (whose paternity I personally doubt), Myrcella, and Tommen. Since Tommen and Myrcella are so obviously in Dany's way, I cannot imagine an alliance that could be formed so that Dany could betray either of them. Oh, and then there's Jon... Personally, I think this could really be the betrayal of Ice by Fire.

 

[the smiling weirwood]

I kind of like the Dany thing, but seriously Boaz...you should consider working for the Weekly World News. Petyr Baelish was a foster son of Hoster Tully because the plot demanded he be exposed to the Tully girls.

 

[Ursa major]

While that's probably true, TSW, GRRM will have built a less deus ex machina reason into the plot (albeit, a part we haven't yet seen).


And that ae in the name business is so tenuous, it has a chance of being true. (Possibly.)

 

[Weasel Soup]

Could a song of Ice and Fire be so obvious as the R+L=J be more patently the result?

I hope not. For some reason I canot get that removed from my head.

I actually fear that as a result, way to WoT. Anyhoo, Dany and Tyrion may meet but I don't think he's a head of the dragon. It would be satisfying, but Tyrion seems to cause the course of events and always be second fiddle. I can see Dany awarding him Castlery Rock.

Sometimes the overt and boring may need to be said.

But Jon more so than Dany I believe is the center of the story as his story arc is the prologue of the series. And the name of the series, the lineage, the poetry and all other things westeros, his brother and sister "knowing" the old ways as does he, and the others being defeated 7700 years (i believe) prior to Targareyans, points to him.

meh....maybe I am just morose today.

 

[Boaz]

Petyr Baelish was a foster son of Hoster Tully because the plot demanded he be exposed to the Tully girls.

Absolutly, Woody. But...

Now I have to make two disclaimers to my "But". The frist is that Petyr knowing (not in a biblical sense) the Tully girls at a young age furthers the overall plot immensely. But GRRM knows this and, as an author who has earned my respect (thank God fro Aretah Franklin spelling this word or I might mess it up), should be able to explian how he arrived at this scenario to begin with... or esel as Ursa has pointed out, we have a deus ex machina to begin the plot.

The second "but" is that I'm drunk. Okay, I just got home from a wedding reecption. Seriously... I am drunk, but I also had a second "but", but I forgot it while I was making my first ponit.

I wish you had as much fun reading this post as I had at the party tonight... I've gotta work tomorrow... Crap.

Edit: I hope you had as much fun reaidng my post as I had at teh party.

Uh, teh rela reason for editng is to tell you that I remembred my other "but".

Yeah, WS, Jon is both the Ice and Fire of ASOIAF. Hmmmm, it seemed so imprtant to say earlier. Now it does nto look like all that impressinve of a statement.

Must go pass out...

 

[TK-421]

Another crazy thing I believe is that House Baelish is a ******* offshoot of House Targaryen.

First, House Baelish was established during Targaryen rule.

Well, not sure this is really an important point as the Targaryen rule was long enough that I am sure other houses were also established during that time. Petyr shows no common physical features with the Targaryens.

he is what he seems: a little, witty man punching way above his weight and about the get knocked-out.

 

[the smiling weirwood]

His name is weird because his grandfather was from one of the Free Cities. So foreign and derived from ******* Valyrian, but not Targaryen.

 

[Dolorous Nate]

An obvious piece of speculation: Aurane Waters will turn out to be the mummer's dragon that the crowd will cheer with such vigor...

With Bran not scheduled (when I had last checked) to appear during the entirety of AFFC and ADWD, reading his ENTIRE story arc starting with AGoT and ending in ADOS will only take the average reader 1 hour...

How much time will pass before the series is over? This will affect whether or not characters like Rickon can eventually play a stronger part?

Back to speculation, all is well and fine with the R+L=J theory except no living character is privy to this information - save for Howland Reed, thus "the value of Howland Reed" will be demonstrated.

Here's one to chew on: Samwell Tarly is not long for the Citadel. The Ironborn will soon capture oldtown, and Sam will fullfill the prophecy of the "drowned" crow sailing with a soon-to-be-dead captain to play a part in Dany's story arc.

 

[Dolorous Nate]

An observation on the full series story arc: (This is just a gut feeling based on the books thus far and comments made by GRRM) Dany, Tyrion, and Jon are the triumvirate of GRRM beloved characters around which the Song of Ice and Fire is built.

All three are characters that began their life cast aside in some manner, and each of them are walking a hard road to get where they must go. Of all of the POVs these three appear to be written as if GRRM has known these people in real life.

They are not neccessarily all three heads of the dragon, but the labor of love that has gone into each of these three sets them apart from the other characters in the series. This story is for them.

Any thoughts?

 

[whiskeyntattoos]

I had a thought cross my mind, its a bit fuzzy.

In a Storm of Swords, in one of Arya's pov the brotherhood without banners go this hill place. They seek councel from a really old lady that has some soothsaying abilities. The lady tell them were to find Catelyn. I know this in the southernish part of the realm but I remember the lady saying the Thoros that his powers wouldn't work here. I think she had some old powers from the old gods.

My question: Could that old lady be one of the surviving children of the forest? She did have powers of the old gods, i think.

I know this is quite random and has little description, but this thought is going to nag me endless, I just had to share it.

they were in a circle of wierwood stumps when the crone was talking about powers not working

 

[whiskeyntattoos]

An observation on the full series story arc: (This is just a gut feeling based on the books thus far and comments made by GRRM) Dany, Tyrion, and Jon are the triumvirate of GRRM beloved characters around which the Song of Ice and Fire is built.

also they all killed their mothers coming into this world

about Sam why would he join the ironborn they are ruthless and care only about plunder and conquest sam is a coward, when dany saw those prophecies i thought they were separate the dead man on the ship smiling i was guessing it was Amon, but it is a good point , didnt Mel talk to davos about a once drowned man returning to greatness or something i assumed the drowned man would be Theon smashing the boltons

maybe if the wall falls Bran will be Bran the builder the second of his name

 

[thesoothsayer]

Patchface as an agent of the Drowned God. If I remember correctly, he was supposed to be dead when he suddenly resuscitated just as they were dragging him off for burial. He seems to display some prophetic powers as well.

 

[whiskeyntattoos]

Is patchface on the wall now too with stannis? that could be the drowned crow with seaweed on him that dany see in the house of the undying

 

[thesoothsayer]

He's at Eastwatch with Stannis' daughter, I think.

 

[TK-421]

With Bran not scheduled (when I had last checked) to appear during the entirety of AFFC and ADWD, reading his ENTIRE story arc starting with AGoT and ending in ADOS will only take the average reader 1 hour...

I'm sorry, you lost me there? Bran will be front and centre in ADWD.

 

[IlliferThePenniless]

We've even seen a Bran spoiler chapter...