Least Favorite Characters

[Aegon the Unworthy]

Interesting....here I feel Stannis is torn between the desire to claim what is his and the methods to do it. What you see as vacillating I see as his uncompromising attitude clashing with reality. For example; those leeches....he doesnt want to do it...but realizes he's in a dire situation so therefore he compromises...or going to the Wall...or his relationship with Davos; most Kings would behead someone for his betrayal...but Stannis raises him up for saving him from himself (specifically referencing the Edric Storm affair).

I can accept he has no politics, because he lacks the personality for it...I get that. But isn't it the least bit admirable that he wont bend the knee to an incest born king? Lesser men would...and have.

I love the presence of Madame M and Davos acting like the two halves of his morale compass...she is win at all costs, and he is victory through honor or no victory at all...that is the crux of Stannis. With each compromise he moves closer and closer to evil...for the nonce though he teeters almost imperceptibly close to the precipice and that is what makes him interesting.

Just for the record, I am not saying Stannis should be the next King. With Cersei out of the picture Tommen is just as good as anyone...and whoever said Hot Pie for King probably has the right of it. Stannis would be a horrible king...but thats another discussion.

Stannis is interesting thats really all Im saying. I shouldnt have used the word likable earlier. Honestly I dont want to have a beer with the guy or anything. I meant likable as in an interesting read.

 

[TK-421]

Well, my 5 cents:

1) I didn't think any was "wrong" on these threads. Tend to stay away from that word.

2) Dany will not be an invader. Especially with Dorne and likely several others backing her. And if she get's the nod from the Sparrows and she's already shown to favour the little people, well, the kingdom is hers. Besides history is riddled with bad kings mucking it up for future generations. (Yes, I am a big fan of Dany)

3) Stannis is predictable and, as SW indicated a flat character. I still enjoy reading about how he will never win the war and the Iron Throne because of his attitude and approach to ruling. It's more of because Davos and Melissandre (and now Jon by default) that reading anything about Stannis is interesting. A point you expressed very well in your last post Aegon.

4) I don't think he went to the Wall to save the kingdom. He went out of desperation and because he had nowehere else to go. He also knew that the Lannisters were not going to let hin just sit on Dragonstone, especially after he was seriously weakened.

5) He needs Davos because he is loyal to a fault.

6) If I recall Renly and and Robb also did not bend the knee to Joff and they were better men than Stannis. They are both dead now however.

It's not him that's likeable but Davos. However, Aegon, I agree that it should be interesting to see where Stannis ends up. But I think Melissandre will kill him in the end as he is not Azor Ahai reborn. And I wouldn't have a Dornish red with him either. Tyrion, Jaime and Sandor, however would be at the top of my list as drinking comerades.

 

[Aegon the Unworthy]

Well, my 5 cents:

1) I didn't think any was "wrong" on these threads. Tend to stay away from that word.

That was a joke...I know, I know put a smiley thing on it if its tongue in cheek....dammit Im not technologically savvy ....its not my fault I dont know theres a difference between a track ball and a mouse. Specifically it was if you dont like Davos..well you're wrong....so I apologize for not putting a smiley...and for the joke as well, bad humor is no laughing matter. (alright I learned something new)

2) Dany will not be an invader. Especially with Dorne and likely several others backing her. And if she get's the nod from the Sparrows and she's already shown to favour the little people, well, the kingdom is hers. Besides history is riddled with bad kings mucking it up for future generations. (Yes, I am a big fan of Dany)

Looking at the best case scenario, Dorne, Riverrun and maybe the Arbor get to decide who is King even if the other houses dont want a change in power? So then Dany sends the Dragons and Unsullied against Kingsport, the Lion, the Squid, the Rose and whats left of the Direwolf....how is that not invading?

3) Stannis is predictable and, as SW indicated a flat character. I still enjoy reading about how he will never win the war and the Iron Throne because of his attitude and approach to ruling. It's more of because Davos and Melissandre (and now Jon by default) that reading anything about Stannis is interesting. A point you expressed very well in your last post Aegon.

Hmm...dont know what to say except I disagree. Stannis is the pendulum as he sways between them...but thats okay, Ive been disagreed with at least once this week alone. Seriously we disagree...you think he's flat... I dont think Ill lose much sleep over it tonight...and neither will you Im sure

4) I don't think he went to the Wall to save the kingdom. He went out of desperation and because he had nowehere else to go. He also knew that the Lannisters were not going to let hin just sit on Dragonstone, especially after he was seriously weakened.

Umm doesnt he say something about "Having a crown so he can save a kingdom when it should be saving the kingdom so he can have a crown"...I didnt get it right but I know thats the gist of it...he went because it was the right thing to do to expect people to follow you. Noblesse oblige if you will. Nobility has a responsibility to the people....only he and Dany (of the pretenders...err contenders to the crown) really see that. Thanks to Davos of course.

6) If I recall Renly and and Robb also did not bend the knee to Joff and they were better men than Stannis. They are both dead now however.

Im not going to argue this with you....if you feel Renly was a man of better character and principle then...well...I dont even have a joke here....

Robb I can accept of course. He's the awesomest....

 

[Aegon the Unworthy]

And I wouldn't have a Dornish red with him either. Tyrion, Jaime and Sandor, however would be at the top of my list as drinking comerades.

Sometimes I reread things and I realize I missed the funniest part of the whole thing...you realize you would rather drink with patricide , regicide and (if he had his way) fratricide instead of Stannis? Remind me never to hang with you at a pub....dont want to meet your friends.

 

[TK-421]

LOL!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks for the good humour as well. Yes, I started the series fairly naive and liking the "honourable" characters like Ned and Robert but have degraded into liking redeemed (somewhat) vilians like the three I would hang around with. Others that would complete my table at the pub are Asha, Victorion, the Queen of Thorns, Doran Martell, the Red Viper, Varys and Barristan the Bold.

We can agree to disagree on Stannis' character, leadership capabilities, etc. but I think we do agree that the POV's with him in it are interesting to read.

 

[the smiling weirwood]

Ha! Can you imagine the sheer hilarity of the scenario that would involve all those characters going into a pub together? Hahaheehee!

We'll all just have to agree to disagree.

 

[Koopa]

well there is this much to say about Stannis, he's got one of the most amazing castles (Storm's End -just the name already) and the Baratheons (cool name in itself) got the best words on their coat of arms,i mean come on, Ours Is The Fury, it can't get better then that.

 

[Raven]

Sometimes I reread things and I realize I missed the funniest part of the whole thing...you realize you would rather drink with patricide , regicide and (if he had his way) fratricide instead of Stannis? Remind me never to hang with you at a pub....dont want to meet your friends.

To be fair, Stannis is a fratricide too, if indirectly. And he'd happily be a regicide given the chance (though he wouldn't call it that).

 

[Aegon the Unworthy]

To be fair, Stannis is a fratricide too, if indirectly. And he'd happily be a regicide given the chance (though he wouldn't call it that).

as the little white mouse from Tom and Jerry says...touche monsieur pussycat...

 

[TK-421]

well there is this much to say about Stannis, he's got one of the most amazing castles (Storm's End -just the name already) and the Baratheons (cool name in itself) got the best words on their coat of arms,i mean come on, Ours Is The Fury, it can't get better then that.

Yes the Baratheon motto is cool but I prefer We do not Sow

 

[Koopa]

The Kraken in itself is a bit cooler then the stag(though not much), still i like the Baratheon words more, the lion and the rose are ugly (and i do not base this upon the persons in the house, just how i feel about their coat of arms), dornes are truly ugly, and the coolest house name to me is aswell Baratheon, Blackfyre is nice as well.

 

[ladylioness]

hey i like the lanister coat of arms although their words are a bit pathetic to say the least. in my opinion the targaryens have the best words "fire and blood", sigil three headed dragon (who couldnt love a dragon), and name. i do agree with the tyrell coat of arms i just dont like it or the people who serve the rose or the roses themselves.

 

[Koopa]

come on, the lion is so funny to see, the way it stands upright, and the way they trie to resemble fur, its just ugly

 

[Barristan the Bold]

among the lesser characters:

 

[Queen Cersei]

Come now, there's nothing wrong with the Lannister's sigil, but I do agree the Targ's is the best. I want a pet dragon.

Tyrells have a pansy sigil. Almost literally. Stupid Tyrells.

 

[TK-421]

among the lesser characters:

What about the lesser characters? Who we like the least or who's motto and sigil is the best? Seems like there a couple of exchanges going on here at the same time.

If it's lest liked lesser characters, I offer Ser Hyle Hunt (the one who travels with Brienne), Bolton's ******* and both Kettleblacks.

 

[Barristan the Bold]

Everybody's got their favourite "least favourite" character. One of endearing elements of this story is Martin's ability to use characters, even his minor characters add a lot in the way of colour.
Among the lesser characters I found despicable, and worthy of a nasty ending (or have already gotten it):

1. Jorah Mormont - big loser, shows that Sandor is right about
knights. Let's down his father, his wife, and letcherous to
boot.

2. Robert Baratheon - a drunk and wife beater, no self control at all! A
pathetic end for a pathetic person.

3. Shae - a whore in the trashiest way, one of the few characters to
receive vengence from the one she betrayed by testifying
against Tyrion. Her ending added a lot to the closing of SOS,
and reveals much about Tywin Lannister; which many here
don't talk about much.

4. Ser Boros Blount (i think) - the sop who helped save Sansa. He was
merely a lowlife, until Littlefinger revealed that he actually just
sold Sansa, despite her saving his life. His ending was fitting.

5. The Kettlebacks - all of them, stupid and adolescent. They'll make
good fodder for Martin!

There's a lot to choose from....might be worth a thread!

 

[Raven]

Everybody's got their favourite "least favourite" character. One of endearing elements of this story is Martin's ability to use characters, even his minor characters add a lot in the way of colour.
Among the lesser characters I found despicable, and worthy of a nasty ending (or have already gotten it):

1. Jorah Mormont - big loser, shows that Sandor is right about
knights. Let's down his father, his wife, and letcherous to
boot.

He let down his wife?

What an odd thing to criticise Jorah for. Everything we know about Lynesse and Jorah shows that he did everything he could think of, including letting down his father, in an attempt not to let her down, before she finally left him.

I mean, what exactly are you criticising him for there? Not doing enough to please Lynesse?

3. Shae - a whore in the trashiest way, one of the few characters to
receive vengence from the one she betrayed by testifying
against Tyrion. Her ending added a lot to the closing of SOS,
and reveals much about Tywin Lannister; which many here
don't talk about much.

Um... that gets talked about rather a lot, actually.

4. Ser Boros Blount (i think) - the sop who helped save Sansa. He was
merely a lowlife, until Littlefinger revealed that he actually just
sold Sansa, despite her saving his life. His ending was fitting.

That would be Dontos Hollard. Blount is the lowlife Kingsguard.

 

[TK-421]

I also found the inclusion of Jorah Mormont as odd and counter to my vision and understanding of the character. Sure, his love or infatuation for Dany was a little disturbing (the age difference mostly) but he's a character that needs redumption of some kind. He needs to find peace with himself, his past and a place in the future. Will he remain loyal to Dany. I hope he does but I alse recall the Old Bear's dying words to Sam or Jon (can't remember which one) that his son has been forgiven in his father's eyes and he should take the black. Maybe he won't need to if Dany wins back the throne and gives him Bear Island.

 

[AryaUnderfoot]

he's a character that needs redumption

I agree. He certainly needs redumption.

I don't have much of a soft spot for Ser Jorah. He thinks with the little head, as it were, and makes some pretty stupid decisions. He really needs to man up.