I no longer feel obligated to purchase ADWD. Is that wrong?

I'll buy it because I think it's the last book in the series we'll ever see. I honestly think GRRM is just sick of writing this series. He'll make some stabs at making a book 6 but I doubt that he ever gets around to finishing it. And no, I'm not saying that because of his age. I'd say the same if he were 20 years younger.
 
I'll buy it because I think it's the last book in the series we'll ever see. I honestly think GRRM is just sick of writing this series. He'll make some stabs at making a book 6 but I doubt that he ever gets around to finishing it. And no, I'm not saying that because of his age. I'd say the same if he were 20 years younger.
Why do you think this? It seems to me that he had a really easy out when he encountered so much difficulty with book 5. If he wanted to quit he could have used "Kong" as an excuse, and my guess is that everyone would have understood.
 
Yes, at the risk of sounding hopelessly naive, I tend to take GRRM at his word that he thought he knew where the story was going, but then ran into massive structural problems that meant he basically had to scrap a near-as-dammit-already-written book and start from scratch. Imagine how demoralising that must be. So, I really don't blame him for the delays. And if he never finishes the series (which, if it happened, I think would purely be down to mortality rather than desire, and I don't think will happen anyway, because AFFC/ADWD seems to represent a very real one-time problem that hopefully won't crop up again as the series approaches its climax and the plot comes into starker focus, presumably), then we can spend the rest of our lives wildly speculating on the internets, the way we have these past few years. Win/win, Y/N? :D

Edited for spelling.
 
Well the thing is I got to know the guy at my local library that orders the new books and I also got him into the series a few years back. So I know he will be ordering ADWD and I will probably just read it from the library instead of buying it, seeing as about 2 years ago I let a friend at work borrow my copy of A Clash of Kings and now she says she lost it...so my set is incomplete anyway.
 
Well the thing is I got to know the guy at my local library that orders the new books and I also got him into the series a few years back. So I know he will be ordering ADWD and I will probably just read it from the library instead of buying it, seeing as about 2 years ago I let a friend at work borrow my copy of A Clash of Kings and now she says she lost it...so my set is incomplete anyway.
She lost it and won't replace it, or you haven't asked, or don't care? Restitution is in order IMO
 
I expect the problem is that A Clash of Kings is such a slim volume, it's easily mislaid.





(It's all GRRM's fault. Why can't he write books of a decent length, for once...? ;):))
 
She lost it and won't replace it, or you haven't asked, or don't care? Restitution is in order IMO

Agreed.

I have a friend who, many years ago, lost my copy of H.G. Wells' War of the Worlds. I still remind him of it every now and again :D. Not that he's replaced it mind you. Git.
 
Agreed.

I have a friend who, many years ago, lost my copy of H.G. Wells' War of the Worlds. I still remind him of it every now and again :D. Not that he's replaced it mind you. Git.
I learned my lesson many years ago. I don't lend stuff out very often, but when I do, I make a note of who got my stuff, and I make it clear to them that I expect it returned by a certain preagreed upon date. And i never loan money. That's the best way to lose a friend.
 
I learned my lesson many years ago. I don't lend stuff out very often, but when I do, I make a note of who got my stuff, and I make it clear to them that I expect it returned by a certain preagreed upon date. And i never loan money. That's the best way to lose a friend.

Haha! But the best way to make sure you aren't stiffed by unreliable friends!

I can assure you I learnt my lesson well on that one :)
 
I was a big fan of Robert Jordan and I agree there are a few similarities of losing the plot with AFFC. I like the Brienne chapters, I think I'd rather it if some of the Dorne stuff got chopped like Areo and Arys, perhaps Ariane. Too much Ironborn as well, could've done without Aeron (it's late here so forgive me if the name's wrong). I didn't like the Cersei chapters either but that may just be because she's so odious. It kinda felt to me like just chucking some chapters in there to fatten the book.

That's what I'm thinking. It was one thing if it was out and paired with ADWD as he claimed at the time. I feel like if that was the case, it would have been out by now, which is why I'm concerned that he's lost control. And the reason people remember Brianne is that she's one of the only familiar characters. I didn't mind her wandering that much, it's just that almost everything else was so forgettable. I can't remember any of the stuff you mention here, and even the names are barely ringing bells. The only really interesting or memorable part was sansa and petyr.
 
Why do you think this? It seems to me that he had a really easy out when he encountered so much difficulty with book 5. If he wanted to quit he could have used "Kong" as an excuse, and my guess is that everyone would have understood.

I think he's more interested in doing other things. He's more interested in touring cons, editing compilations, and whatever else he does than in writing ASOIAF. This is not meant to be a knock against him. I think he simply got bored with or felt burdened by writing ASOIAF. He continues to plug away at it because he's got a huge base of people with huge expectations. What I'm saying, is that I don't think he wants to be committed to writing the series anymore. It seems more like a chore now than something fun. That's why I think he'll never finish book 6. I hope I'm wrong but I'd definitely bet against book 6 ever coming out. Anyone interested in betting?
 
I do agree that writing probably HAS become something of a chore for GRRM, but I believe that's only because he got stuck with the Meereenese knot and he backed himself into a corner he couldn't easily get out of. Once he's through with that (and I think Dances will take him by the worst of it), I believe that his production will improve. (I may have mentioned earlier that I am an optimistic fool, however if I keep saying these things, I'm sure they will come true!) :D
 
But Donaldson wrote other things.

Don't sully Steven King's understanding of what being a professional writer means.
Yeah King did absolutely nothing between Dark Tower books.

Novels:
The Dark Tower I: The Gunslinger (1982; revised edition, 2003)
The Running Man (as Richard Bachman) (1982)
Christine (1983)
Pet Sematary (1983)
Cycle of the Werewolf (1983)
The Talisman (1984, written with Peter Straub)
Thinner (as Richard Bachman) (1984)
It (1986)
The Eyes of the Dragon (1987)
Misery (1987)
The Dark Tower II: The Drawing of the Three (1987)
The Tommyknockers (1987)
The Dark Half (1989)
Needful Things (1990)
The Dark Tower III: The Waste Lands (1991)
Gerald's Game (1992)
Dolores Claiborne (1993)
Insomnia (1994)
Rose Madder (1995)
The Green Mile (1996)
Desperation (1996)
The Regulators (as Richard Bachman) (1996)
The Dark Tower IV: Wizard and Glass (1997)
Bag of Bones (1998)
The Girl Who Loved Tom Gordon (1999)
Dreamcatcher (2001)
Black House (2001, written with Peter Straub)
From a Buick 8 (2002)
The Dark Tower V: Wolves of the Calla (2003)
The Dark Tower VI: Song of Susannah (2004)
The Dark Tower VII: The Dark Tower (2004)



Non-fiction:
Nightmares in the Sky (1988)
On Writing: A Memoir of the Craft (2000)
Secret Windows: Essays and Fiction on the Craft of Writing (2000)

I didn't even include his short stories.
I really dig GRRM and ASOIAF, but clearly Martin is a bit of a lazy writer.
I actually really enjoyed AFFC, thought it was a natural pause in the action of the story and so, was necessary.


Phil,

In no way did i mean to put down two of my favourite writers and storytellers. And am very aware of the fact that they wrote other things! As you mention you didn't add King's short stories, perhaps you should have being as one of them directly links itself to the Dark Tower series. I simply meant between the books in those series there was a long wait, not that they didn't put anything else out there for the avid fan to read.
 
Yes, at the risk of sounding hopelessly naive, I tend to take GRRM at his word that he thought he knew where the story was going, but then ran into massive structural problems that meant he basically had to scrap a near-as-dammit-already-written book and start from scratch. Imagine how demoralising that must be.


Got to admit I won;t be rushing out for ADWD, namely because I feel the series has become so convoluted with different character perspectives that I just won't be able to follow what's happening unless I re-read the previous books with a fine tooth comb.

I really enjoyed the first book, but as the character perspectives have grown I've gradually felt it thinned out the story, so what we end up with is world-building with a narrative.

The Jaime and Cersei POV's were interesting in the follow ups, and as major characters were certainly worth exploring, but I feel GRRM became far too interested in the intricacies of following minor characters to the detriment of the main story. I really really don't want to know what peripheral characters in a story are doing unless it's important to the story, but I've never gotten that feeling.

Oh, sure, Stannis and the Onion King were part of the story - but it was the back story. It never felt significant. And a sectoon ehaded Brien just says to me "skip this chapter"!

Anyway, I know I've main my views plain before - I would love it if an editor would dare to tame GRRM's character explorations and force him to keep focused on the main characters for the main story, and release background novels based on other minor characters separately.

However, I appreciate different people have different tastes - heck, there are a load of Author boards on chronicles and I doubt everyone here has read books by all of them.

And by all accounts, those who really enjoy the ASoFaI really appreciate the detail and the world-building that has obviously gone on with the books.

I just personally feel left behind by it all - I need to feel engaged with a story, but I haven't felt like with with the last couple of books.

Maybe I'll return to it one day, but in the meantime, I enjoyed my ride, A Game of Thrones was a great piece of literature, but I'll wave bon voyage to those who keep with the series and hope they truly get to a satisfying ending.

Perhaps, then, I'll be persuaded to return.

In the meantime, though, as before, everyone has different interests, and just because something doesn;t grab you, doesn't mean to say you have to pservere, or make life difficult for those who like oranges when you like apples. :)
 
Has anyone asked GRRM himself if he's lost some of the "magic" in his writing the series? Does he view it more as a "chore" now? Would be good to hear from the horse's mouth than speculate about how he feels about it.

Send him an email and if you ask nicely, he just may respond.
 
Has anyone asked GRRM himself if he's lost some of the "magic" in his writing the series? Does he view it more as a "chore" now? Would be good to hear from the horse's mouth than speculate about how he feels about it.

Send him an email and if you ask nicely, he just may respond.

Sounds like you're elected, TK!:D
 
Someone asked GRRM about this (in a polite way) in Belfast last year. He basically said that no, but that some days were very hard and frustrating and hard work and some were very easy and wrote themselves and it was a lot of fun, and it's been that way through the whole series. The only difference on AFFC and ADWD was that the structrual issues were extremely complex and he was more making up the story on the fly, making them more challenging.
 
I think (perhaps hope) that all this time spent is actually getting together two complete books plus the outline for the final one, so that there is a definite plan for finishing it all in a reasonable time frame.

I've already decided not to fork out for ADWD until the end is in sight.
 
I think (perhaps hope) that all this time spent is actually getting together two complete books plus the outline for the final one, so that there is a definite plan for finishing it all in a reasonable time frame.

I've already decided not to fork out for ADWD until the end is in sight.
Are you saying you won't read it or you just won't buy it?
 

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