So what's the latest crackpot theory?

During COK - I believe he genuinely wants to help Tyrion save King's Landing. During Storm of Swords, Stannis says that he counseled Robert to get rid of people like Varys. It's very doubtful that Varys would have survived Stannis winning the Iron Throne, so all support had to go to House Lanister. If I'm right about Shae he always knew he had a way to get rid of Tyrion if he needed to, but as events transpired he never needed to pull that trigger.

I found no fault in your logic, however, I do want to address the idea that Shae, and possibly Bronn, were Varys' "little birds" all grown up. This would not be possible as Varys' little birds have their tongues removed. Also, they appear to have a fairly short lifespan, as indicated in Varys' conversation with illyrio.

I still feel as through Varys and Littlefinger are working together, at least in some capacity. To my mind, it almost seems like they have to be. I don't think Either of them would really be able to do what they are doing without having at least some kind of assurance that the other's plans wont interfere. Otherwise I think both would consider the other too dangerous to live.
 
I found no fault in your logic, however, I do want to address the idea that Shae, and possibly Bronn, were Varys' "little birds" all grown up. This would not be possible as Varys' little birds have their tongues removed. Also, they appear to have a fairly short lifespan, as indicated in Varys' conversation with illyrio.

I still feel as through Varys and Littlefinger are working together, at least in some capacity. To my mind, it almost seems like they have to be. I don't think Either of them would really be able to do what they are doing without having at least some kind of assurance that the other's plans wont interfere. Otherwise I think both would consider the other too dangerous to live.

Ah yes, I'd forgotten that point. I still think they're suspicious though, especially Shae. Maybe not little birds, but still somehow connected. Or maybe she was only a w***e and ditched Tyrion as soon as things got hot. *shrug*

Littlefinger's part in this, to me, reminds me of that annoyingly eager coworker. You ask them to do some photocopying, and next morning it turns out they've also filed the reports, sent them off and claimed the credit.
 
I don't think Either of them would really be able to do what they are doing without having at least some kind of assurance that the other's plans wont interfere. Otherwise I think both would consider the other too dangerous to live.
I tend to agree.

It helps that both see an opportunity in the chaos they both help create (and which each, on his own**, would find it hard, if not impossible, to produce). Oh, and each gives the other a suspect*** at whom to point if someone powerful finally realises that certain events are not as random as they may first seem, and all other candidates for being the cause can be shown to have been unable to conjure up the event(s) concerned.


** - And it allows each the opportunity to be able to truly demonstrate his lack of involvement in some aspects of the chaos: "I can prove that I had nothing to do with X, Y or Z," said Varys/Littlefinger, "and I can show how I was disadvantaged as a result of each of them. On the other hand, Littlefinger/Varys was around and did benefit." "I can prove that I had no involvement in A, B or C," said Littlefinger/Varys, "and I can show how I was put at a disadvantage as a result of each of them. Varys/Littlefinger, on the other hand, did gain by them, and had every opportunity to arrange them."

*** - This would, inevitably, be each's very last shot**** at attempting to clear himself, which is why each does his best to plausibly implicate others, either by showing how they might be involved (e.g. Tyrion and the knife that almost killed Bran, Sansa being on hand -- and carrying the poison -- with at least one motive for killing Joffrey), or getting them to do the dirty work (e.g. Lysa poisoning her husband, Olenna poisoning Joffrey).

**** - And each would want to make himself scarce (or have the other quickly and safely dispatched) before the other had an opportunity to return the favour. (Which, as someone pointed out above, gives each a reason not to implicate the other too soon, as it would be risking both their lives, and both their plans.)
 
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I haz new theory. Well, technically two theories but they're both about the gods and their representatives, so...

Theory 1: So my rereading has reached Feast for Crows, and I had an interesting thought while reading Aerion's scenes. Much like Mellisandre, he believes he has a direct line to his god. Also like Mellisandre he listens to the Drowned God and misinterprets the message. In his case it was that a Kingsmoot would be the answer to his problem, and as we all know it only sticks him with Euron as a king.

However, there is someone else in Westeros who has drowned and been given back by the sea, and gives out much better prophecies - at least he called the Red Wedding at any rate. I think Patchface has a connection to the Drowned God.

Theory 2: I saw someone elses theory that the Starks represented the 7. I started thinking about the Lannisters, and I think that they also represent the 7, albeit in subverted fashions. I'll go through the ones I'm certain of.

Tywin is the Smith. The Smith brings strength, and Tywin is without a doubt the force that keeps the Lannisters strong. However he subverts this by causing rifts in his efforts to keep the family at the top of the tree. He disowns Jaimie after a dispute, butts heads with Cersei and as for his relationship with Tyrion... Enough said.

Cersei is the Warrior. Pretty obvious really, she's a fighter through and through. Even when she's essentially won her battles, she starts more with Margery and the Tyrells. The subversion is of course she was born the wrong sex, a fact she is often lamenting.

Joffrey is the Stranger. Seemingly a straightforward example, he brings nothing but misery to those who know him, and he does love making people fight to the death. The subversion is that he's pretty bad at inflicting death himself, and while the Stranger is probably the most powerful of the 7, he is the first Lannister to fall.

Tyrion is the Father. Again, a pretty cut and dried argument here, he does love bringing justice. As soon as he arrived in Kings Landing he started dishing out generous helpings of just desserts to Slynt, Pycelle, and would have done to Varys and Littlefinger if they'd taken the bait. He stood up to Joffrey in Sansa's defense when he didn't have to, and he even made a point of paying Mord the gold he's promised. However, for someone so fond of justice, injustice seems to follow him everywhere. He's been put on trial for two murders he didn't commit, falsely arrested and imprisoned at least twice, his own father has tried to get him killed, and despite saving Kings Landing from Stannis he is generally reviled by the populace.

Here's where we get to the parts I'm not too sure of.

Jamie is either the Mother, or the Crone. I'm leaning more toward the Mother, but he has shown that when he actually uses it he's got a pretty capable brain. The reason I think he's the Mother though starts becoming evident during Clash of Kings. He saves Brienne from Harrenhal even though he didn't have to. He saved Tyrion when it would have been safer to let him die. He keeps his vow not to take up arms against the Tullys, and finds non violent solutions to taking Tully held castles. Showing mercy, or wisdom? As I said I'm not too sure which. Even killing Aerys could be considered a mercy seeing what he was planning for Kings Landing. The subversion is of course he was supposed to be the Warrior. He only grows into his true role after losing his sword hand.

Tommen is the Maid. He's amiable, loving and would be perfectly content if you just stuffed him in a room full of kittens. A far cry from what is expected of a man in Westeros. If he'd been born a Tarly, he'd have been saying hello to his big brother Samwell on the wall before long.

That would leave Mrycella as the Crone, but my rereading hasn't gotten to her parts yet so I have no evidence to back this up.
 
@MemoryTale I like your reasoning. just based on my own memory I would actually put Jaime as the Crone (for reasons you already stated) and Myrcella as the mother just because she seems to fit the Mother better than the crone. Myrcella is very protective of Tommen and shows compassion and mercy more than wisdom.
 
The third head of the dragon is Davos Seaworth who is Dragonseed from Flea's Bottom reborn in salt and smoke during the Battle of Blackwater. It just makes crazy sense in my head for some reason.
 
What if the Others are a symptom rather than the problem? There has to be a reason they haven't been seen in 5000 years. What if they're a natural response from the magical world because the maesters want to do away with magic?
 
The third head of the dragon is Davos Seaworth who is Dragonseed from Flea's Bottom reborn in salt and smoke during the Battle of Blackwater. It just makes crazy sense in my head for some reason.

I like it too! wouldn't THAT be out of left field.

What if the Others are a symptom rather than the problem? There has to be a reason they haven't been seen in 5000 years. What if they're a natural response from the magical world because the maesters want to do away with magic?

I like this idea, that the return of the Others is a reaction to something else going on in the world. Maybe it is the same for the Dragons being born to Dany, surely not a coincidence that this all happened within a few months. The Alchemists (?) making the wildfire hint that their "spells" are working more efficiently and say it means that Dragons are back in the world, and the Bulldog is able to light the glass candles in Old Town. So clearly this world is somehow attuned to magic and magical creatures. So the question is, are the Dragons a reaction to the waking of the White Walkers, or are both a reaction to something else entirely?
 
hahaha You and me and my sister all. XD She's been raving about that theory since I mentioned it. XD

I love it! I can just picture Davos standing in front of a dragon mumbling something about being unworthy to ride one. He could change his banner to a dragon with an onion in it's jaws :D
 
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I love it! I can just picture Davos standing in front of a dragon mumbling something about being unworthy to ride one. He could change his banner to a dragon with an onion in it's jaws :D
It would be hilarious and I would just adore it. XD
 
What if the Others are a symptom rather than the problem? There has to be a reason they haven't been seen in 5000 years. What if they're a natural response from the magical world because the maesters want to do away with magic?

I mentioned something like this a year or so ago, but different. I theorized that Mance Raider had unwittingly 're-awakened' them from their sleep in the glacier in which he was looking for the Horn of Jarumen...
 
I've equipped my keyboard with a +3 in necromancy.

What if Danerys is not as done with betrayals as she thinks she is? she was told she'd have a betrayal for blood (Mirri Maz Dur), one for gold (Brown Ben) and one for love (Jorah). I have several problems with this. First and foremost, they've been happening in the wrong order. Jorah's betrayal was the last mentioned, but came first, Brown Ben didn't betray her for gold as much as he wanted to be on the winning side, and Mirri had already betrayed her when she received this prediction - surely you wouldn't say "You will know three betrayals" if one had already happened? Throw in the fact that Jorah was betraying Viserys and not Danerys and it looks a little suspect.

I think she's only had one of the prophesized betrayals. Still Brown Ben, but not for gold - for blood. Namely he didn't want to shed his on her behalf.
 
I think the betrayal for love will be Jon Snow, it will be inadvertent and it will lead to her death. But now I think about it maybe it will be Faegon...
 
The only treason that I think may have already happened is Hizdar, for gold.

I think it could be argued that and he of the other ones people have talked about, such as Jorah or Mirri Maz Duur don't hold up to close scritony or logic.
 
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This is more of an errant thought than a theory, but what if Shadrich of the Shady Glen is actually in Varys' employment to find Sansa? In AFFC, he mentions Varys as the person who is offering gold, but can that be true? Varys is no longer the Master of Whispers at that point.
 
Apologies if this crackpot theory has been done before, but it just came to me on a train journey.

It's well known that Westeros is roughly based upon the shape of the UK, with cold Scotland above Hadrian's wall, and King's Landing acting as a kind of London avatar.

I was just looking at a website which has an interactive map of what parts of the world would look like if submerged underwater after unmitigated climate change or rising sea levels over a certain number of years.

Interestingly, the U.K. Under 60 metres of water looks a lot like Westeros. GRRM has said that in A Dream Of Spring he'll finally reveal why the seasons in westeros are so out of bonk.

You get where I'm going with this, right?

Does anyone think that ASOIAF is actually set in an alternative future of our real world (a la Prince of Thorns after the nuclear winter)??
 
From World Ice&Fire book :When they do consent to trade, the Skagosi offer pelts, obsidian blades and arrowheads, and “unicorn horns” for goods they desire.

Maybe the skagosi remember more from the long night than the rest of the north.
 

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