SPOILERS: Theory on Jon

Is it true that GRRM wont' confirm that it was Elia in the vision? The Citadel prophecy break down thingy implies that he's confirmed it was both Aegon and Elia in that vision. Confirming Aegon but not Elia would confuse things terribly.

And send my mind spinning down a hundred unlikely paths.
 
The Jon=Aegon theory is more or less debunked by the simple fact that alot of effort is spent reminder readers that Jon has the Stark look more than any of the other legitimate children (except Arya). Baby Aegon did not.
 
The Jon=Aegon theory is more or less debunked by the simple fact that alot of effort is spent reminder readers that Jon has the Stark look more than any of the other legitimate children (except Arya). Baby Aegon did not
Click to expand...

Quite agreed. Jon=Aegon requires some very unsubstantiated mental gymnastics.

Is it true that GRRM wont' confirm that it was Elia in the vision? The Citadel prophecy break down thingy implies that he's confirmed it was both Aegon and Elia in that vision. Confirming Aegon but not Elia would confuse things terribly.
Click to expand...

I found that too when I was trying to find where I'd read this... It is quite possible that I am getting this confused with something else Martin has said, or just completely made it up and convinced myself that it was true. You may safely disregard me.
 
I tried to do some searches here and google but found nothing on this side question.

Before leaving the wall for oldtown, Maester Aemon told Jon that he marked a page in a book that he should read. Anyone know anything about that page in the book?

"I left a book for you in my chambers. The Jade compendium. It was written by the Volantene adventurer Colloquo Votar, who traveled to the east and visited all the lands of the Jade Sea. There is a passage you may find of interest. I've told Clydas to mark it for you."

"Knowledge is a weapon, Jon. Arm yourself well before you ride forth to battle."
Click to expand...
 
In my recent reading of ACOK, when Jon and Mormont were talking, it was said that Maester Aemon could have been absolved from his duties to the Nights Watch by the High Septon when he came up for King. I have had my theories as to how Jon's oath to the wall would prevent him from joining the war. I failed to realize this as a possible opportunity for him to honorably step down (if of course he wants or chooses to).

However, with this said i may need help from some of the more experienced ASOIAF readers to see if this is plausible.

1) Cersie restored the High Septons army through her deal to absolve her debt
2) If the high septon absolved Jon of his duties, do you think they would require him to fight with them?
3) Whose side would they be on, and who would be an immediate threat to them? Or is their only purpose to protect the faith?


Some of the details of the Faith have escaped me, but i'm sure with the help of you guys/gals, you can either poke this theory full of holes, or put some new tires on it so that it can get rolling.
 
Illifer, In my own defence, I'd like to say that it's unfair of you to hold me to something that I posted a year ago. Unless you can catch me within twenty-four hours, it is irresponsible of you to try and get me to explain my reasoning for my posts.

(Mayhaps if I derail the thread, they'll forget about Aerys+Lyanna=Jon.)

You guys can trust TK-421, to post, "This is not the thread you are looking for. You can go about your posting."
 
New crackpot theory. GRRM has invested us so much in R+L=J, why couldn't had been some other combination?

How about his brother Brandon who went to King's Landing and got cooked in his armour. Could he not have a *******, with say, Elia of Dorne? or Aerys' wife (who is his sister) Rhealla?

I have this feeling in my gut that GRRM is going to mess with our heads on this one.
 
There sure is ALOT of evidence pointing to the R+L=J theory, one real clincher for me was in a recent re-read:

Danys vision in CoK:

The man had her brother’s hair, but he was taller, and his eyes were a dark indigo rather than lilac. “Aegon,” he said to a woman nursing a newborn babe in a great wooden bed. “What better name for a king?”
“Will you make a song for him?” the woman asked.
“He has a song,” the man replied. “He is the prince that was promised, and his is the song of ice and fire.”

From the tale of the Knight of the Laughing Tree:

“The dragon prince sang a song so sad it made the wolf maid sniffle, but when her pup brother teased her for crying she poured wine over his head.”

The only thing then is, unless I'm missing something it seems to me Aegon has to = Jon Snow, which doesn't sit so well with me.

In fact, on re-readings, the is so much circumstantial evidence pointing to R+L=J, that I almost feel as if that is exactly what GRRM wants us to think.
 
Redmeat, there's something there. HIS is the song of ice and fire. That might just mean that the He here is ... a son of Jon and Dany?
 
It's all in the jade compendium man, the jade compendium foretold it all.
 
redmeat said:
In fact, on re-readings, the is so much circumstantial evidence pointing to R+L=J, that I almost feel as if that is exactly what GRRM wants us to think.
Click to expand...

Thats exactly what I think.
I get lambasted every time I bring this up (so play nice :) ), but Ive always thought Robert was the father of Jon. Rhaegar & Lyanna running off together 'cause theyre in love just doesnt seem very GRRM-like.
 
Robert and who? He's never admitted to having an affair with any highborn woman or one that matters. All we get is whores and Bessy with big %^&.
 
I have suspected Robert let a slow rage fester since the Tourney at Harrenhal after Rhaegar gave Robert's betrothed the roses in front of the whole kingdom. At somepoint thereafter, he got drunk, rode off to wherever Lyanna was and "took her". Robert just doesnt seem to be the type to let that sort of thing slide, particularly when drunk. Cersei even recalls nights where Robert gets drunk, takes her violently then forgets about it. This way, Rhaegar would be protecting Lyanna from marrying a violent drunk, which he is. Also, the members of the Kingsguard being at the ToJ doesnt make sense to me unless Aerys ordered them there to retrieve her.

I should note, what contradicts my theory isnt in the books, but in an email GRRM sent in response to a question from a fan about when Jon was born in relation to Dany. If Jon really was born no more than 9 months before Dany, my theory is toast. But, the email also says "or thereabouts" and GRRM wrote a pre-amble in which he states he really wasnt good at keeping track of the dates - at least by day and month.

Oh, and since Robert's grandfather was a Targaryan, Jon would still be 1/8 Dragon for any possible prophecies or dragon-related events. :)
 
There would be a lot of psychological truth to Robert being Jon's father, as Trey suggests. I have no idea if the other details support it or not.
 
The Baratheon family was around before Aegon the Conqueror. The Baratheons were the Storm Kings. The first Storm King is a legendary figure at the same time as Bran the Builder. Bran assisted the first Storm King in building Storm's End in the face of angry gods.

The last Storm King was defeated by Aegon's ******* brother, Orys. With Aegon's blessing, Orys took the daughter of the last Storm King as his bride. Orys also took the Baratheon name, heraldry, lands and titles... except King. Since then, the Baratheons are the Lords of Storm's End... the primary house of the Stormlords.

There have been seventeen crowned Targaryen monarchs. Viserys and Dany would make eighteen and nineteen named Targaryen rulers of the Targ dynasty. But Dany is only the fourteenth generation from Aegon. Assuming that the Baratheons kept pace with the Targs, then Robert would be either the thirteenth or fourteenth generation from Orys.

The only other infusion of Targ blood into the Baratheon family came from Robert's father's mother, Princess Rhaelle. Her father was Aegon V... Robert's great-grandfather.

Personally, I don't think that Robert would forget date raping Lyanna.

If Robert is Jon's father, then Eddard was not hiding Jon from Robert's wrath, but from the Lannisters'. Tywin and Cersei would never have allowed Jon to live had they known this.

We know of two of Robert's sons, Gendry and Edric. Both are tall for their ages. The only other of his bastards to survive infancy is Mya... and I cannot recall her height. All three of them have black hair. Jon has brown hair. Jon is not tall. That does not prove anything, but it starts a pattern...

Why would Robert fume over Rhaegar raping Lyanna if he'd done the same?

Wouldn't it make more sense for Lyanna to make Eddard promise to hire a drunken septon and make Robert swear that he and Lyanna secretly wed before Lyanna's disappearance? Then Jon would have been legitimate. Robert could still have named Joffrey as heir while having a weapon against Lannister misbehavior.

I prefer my theory of Lyanna being raped by Aerys and then being rescued by Rhaegar. Lyanna was at court. Robert was in The Eyrie. Aerys was a sexual predator. Rhaegar was already married and an honorable man. This would make Jon Dany's elder half brother.

I dunno.

Edit: Of course, I see Aerys' bastards everywhere... Cersei, Jaime, Tyrion, and Jon. If you put those with Aerys' trueborn children, Rhaegar, Viserys, and Daenerys, you have seven. Two years ago I tried to figure out the entire story with a unified theory of everything... Aery's seven children were at the heart of the concept, but I could not make it work.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Thread starter Similar threads Forum Replies Date
L Extremely Crackpot Theory: Darkstar/Aegon Targaryen (Spoilers) George R R Martin 1
G Jon Snow Theory revised -- ADWD Spoilers George R R Martin 14
Young stormlord Crackpot theory: I have found Littlefinger's grandfather [spoilers] George R R Martin 5
juleska A new theory (I think) about Coldhands (Spoilers up thru ADWD) George R R Martin 22
The Imp New crackpot theory- Arya (ADWD SPOILERS) George R R Martin 26

Similar threads


Back
Top